What if "they" were the first 12 from the lazarus missions

The idea is that it's the evolved future humans. Cooper realizes this in the tesseract. So because he and murph save humanity it allows humanity to move among the stars and in billions of years they will be able to move past our dimension.

Now I've read almost all material available and still don't get the ending. Can you help me out?

I think I can say for sure that all those "Coop died/ending is just a death dream"-scenarios are out of their place, because nothing supports them - not the earlier version of scripts, not the interviews, not the novelization etc. And it wouldn't really make sense in a good movie-telling way. If ending has a more complex, deep meaning to it, I think it would have been more ovbious to vievewers.. No it wasn't. Like someone said, we could say that about every movie - that the ending never really happened! It was a dream!

Took this great quote from another discussion: "

The ending of Inception is a good opposite example - we are meant to understand the significance of the spinning of the top, and it cuts out before we ever get to really know what is happening. I can't think of a good example at this second, but commonly if there is an expectation that an ending is not necessarily to be played straight, and you are to draw some conclusions about it, then the filmmaker will leave some clues. I don't think that was really done in this case. For example, if Cooper steals the ship why does the maintenance guy walk in and express surprise that the ship is gone? This is a small detail to encourage us to believe the scene is real, as opposed to one that should make us think it is a dream sequence. Anyway, just my two cents. "

So, if - and I'd say we will - assume that the end actually happened, what happens after that confuses me.

Now, Jonathan Nolan said in one of his interviews that the wormhole closed, and so does the earlier script. The way interview was written left it up for interpretation; was J. Nolan referring to final product or the earlier draft of the script?

Because Cooper Station and her sister stations are orbiting the Saturn, it is pretty sure to assume that they are here because of the wormhole - they have some plans for it, to go through at some point. Now, when Cooper arrives and the wormhole closes, it should have been a pretty big catastrophy for the WHOLE MANKIND. Yet the movie says nothing about that...? Like, in a way Cooper ruined their plans by popping out the hole and making it disappear.

And if the wormhole was closed, Cooper still goes to find Edmund's planet. Either Rangers on Cooper Station have the equipment needed to a)navigate in a vast universe and b)travel fast enough, or then Cooper just wants to make a slow suicide in a spacecraft alone in the deep, vast space. Because if Rangers aren't equipped with things that would get Cooper to Brand in a reasonable time, why bother going? It would be plain madness. You just don't "explore" randomly around the friggin' universe in hope that the planet you are looking for, just pops out. And I don't think Cooper was mad/crazy/suicidical...?

BUT if people on Cooper Station HAVE the technology and skills to get to the far side of the universe, for example to Edmund's planet, why would they be orbiting Saturn? Just for fun? Or just because there was (before Cooper arrived) a wormhole, for more-convenient means of travel. Meaning that they had the technology needed but still traveling through the wormhole was more convenient and faster.


Okay so those were my questions about situation where wormhole had closed.

In the novelization it clearly states that the wormhole is still OPEN. Now that confuses me - isn't novelization pretty "official" source of information? Like, you would think that the author confirmed those details to be correct before putting them into a book? Or is the novelization just some out-of-canon fanfiction?

Also, if you just look at the movie and nothing else, the wormhole being open-scenario would be more logical. Because it would explain why there wasn't any fuss about its disappearance, why Cooper so easily left in a Ranger etc.

In the novelization it says that people haven't yet gone to the other side of the wormhole because they have to be more prepared - human circadian rhytm and such, that the whole human civilization can't just come at once to a deserted planet that has no infrastructure etc. Sounds reasonable enough, and explains why Cooper doesn't want to wait and leaves immediately.

And for clearing things up: Brand arrives at Edmund's planet roughly at the same time as Cooper to the Cooper Station. The difference is like weeks or months, not decades. Also, that explains why people haven't yet gone through the wormhole, at least on a bigger scale, because only at the end of the movie they might be starting to receive the data Brand sends them. And old Murhp knows about Brand being there because he has the knowledge that Cooper has - Cooper himself sent her there. I think these are clear things for many, but not for all, that's why I thought to write them down too.

Oh, and some people thought that the film's starting scene, one with the crash, would actually be something from the future - like crashing on Brand's place. It's clear that in the scene it's not a spaceship and not a spacesuit, it's just normal pilot suit and helmet. I have paid great attention to the details in their suits and the scene doesn't have any deeper meaning. It's just the crash that happened on earth.

Yeah, but I'm kinda lost in here - what is the most official source for information and what is real? Or is there any solid knowledge? I don't want guesses, I want rock-solid truth

Minnie wrote:Now I've read almost all material available and still don't get the ending. Can you help me out?

I think I can say for sure that all those "Coop died/ending is just a death dream"-scenarios are out of their place, because nothing supports them - not the earlier version of scripts, not the interviews, not the novelization etc. And it wouldn't really make sense in a good movie-telling way. If ending has a more complex, deep meaning to it, I think it would have been more ovbious to vievewers.. No it wasn't. Like someone said, we could say that about every movie - that the ending never really happened! It was a dream!

Took this great quote from another discussion: "

The ending of Inception is a good opposite example - we are meant to understand the significance of the spinning of the top, and it cuts out before we ever get to really know what is happening. I can't think of a good example at this second, but commonly if there is an expectation that an ending is not necessarily to be played straight, and you are to draw some conclusions about it, then the filmmaker will leave some clues. I don't think that was really done in this case. For example, if Cooper steals the ship why does the maintenance guy walk in and express surprise that the ship is gone? This is a small detail to encourage us to believe the scene is real, as opposed to one that should make us think it is a dream sequence. Anyway, just my two cents. "

So, if - and I'd say we will - assume that the end actually happened, what happens after that confuses me.

Now, Jonathan Nolan said in one of his interviews that the wormhole closed, and so does the earlier script. The way interview was written left it up for interpretation; was J. Nolan referring to final product or the earlier draft of the script?

Because Cooper Station and her sister stations are orbiting the Saturn, it is pretty sure to assume that they are here because of the wormhole - they have some plans for it, to go through at some point. Now, when Cooper arrives and the wormhole closes, it should have been a pretty big catastrophy for the WHOLE MANKIND. Yet the movie says nothing about that...? Like, in a way Cooper ruined their plans by popping out the hole and making it disappear.

And if the wormhole was closed, Cooper still goes to find Edmund's planet. Either Rangers on Cooper Station have the equipment needed to a)navigate in a vast universe and b)travel fast enough, or then Cooper just wants to make a slow suicide in a spacecraft alone in the deep, vast space. Because if Rangers aren't equipped with things that would get Cooper to Brand in a reasonable time, why bother going? It would be plain madness. You just don't "explore" randomly around the friggin' universe in hope that the planet you are looking for, just pops out. And I don't think Cooper was mad/crazy/suicidical...?

BUT if people on Cooper Station HAVE the technology and skills to get to the far side of the universe, for example to Edmund's planet, why would they be orbiting Saturn? Just for fun? Or just because there was (before Cooper arrived) a wormhole, for more-convenient means of travel. Meaning that they had the technology needed but still traveling through the wormhole was more convenient and faster.


Okay so those were my questions about situation where wormhole had closed.

In the novelization it clearly states that the wormhole is still OPEN. Now that confuses me - isn't novelization pretty "official" source of information? Like, you would think that the author confirmed those details to be correct before putting them into a book? Or is the novelization just some out-of-canon fanfiction?

Also, if you just look at the movie and nothing else, the wormhole being open-scenario would be more logical. Because it would explain why there wasn't any fuss about its disappearance, why Cooper so easily left in a Ranger etc.

In the novelization it says that people haven't yet gone to the other side of the wormhole because they have to be more prepared - human circadian rhytm and such, that the whole human civilization can't just come at once to a deserted planet that has no infrastructure etc. Sounds reasonable enough, and explains why Cooper doesn't want to wait and leaves immediately.

And for clearing things up: Brand arrives at Edmund's planet roughly at the same time as Cooper to the Cooper Station. The difference is like weeks or months, not decades. Also, that explains why people haven't yet gone through the wormhole, at least on a bigger scale, because only at the end of the movie they might be starting to receive the data Brand sends them. And old Murhp knows about Brand being there because he has the knowledge that Cooper has - Cooper himself sent her there. I think these are clear things for many, but not for all, that's why I thought to write them down too.

Oh, and some people thought that the film's starting scene, one with the crash, would actually be something from the future - like crashing on Brand's place. It's clear that in the scene it's not a spaceship and not a spacesuit, it's just normal pilot suit and helmet. I have paid great attention to the details in their suits and the scene doesn't have any deeper meaning. It's just the crash that happened on earth.

Yeah, but I'm kinda lost in here - what is the most official source for information and what is real? Or is there any solid knowledge? I don't want guesses, I want rock-solid truth

The script is number one and the novelization is based exactly on that so those are both the top ones.

Minnie wrote:Now I've read almost all material available and still don't get the ending. Can you help me out?

I think I can say for sure that all those "Coop died/ending is just a death dream"-scenarios are out of their place, because nothing supports them - not the earlier version of scripts, not the interviews, not the novelization etc. And it wouldn't really make sense in a good movie-telling way. If ending has a more complex, deep meaning to it, I think it would have been more ovbious to vievewers.. No it wasn't. Like someone said, we could say that about every movie - that the ending never really happened! It was a dream!

Took this great quote from another discussion: "

The ending of Inception is a good opposite example - we are meant to understand the significance of the spinning of the top, and it cuts out before we ever get to really know what is happening. I can't think of a good example at this second, but commonly if there is an expectation that an ending is not necessarily to be played straight, and you are to draw some conclusions about it, then the filmmaker will leave some clues. I don't think that was really done in this case. For example, if Cooper steals the ship why does the maintenance guy walk in and express surprise that the ship is gone? This is a small detail to encourage us to believe the scene is real, as opposed to one that should make us think it is a dream sequence. Anyway, just my two cents. "

So, if - and I'd say we will - assume that the end actually happened, what happens after that confuses me.

Now, Jonathan Nolan said in one of his interviews that the wormhole closed, and so does the earlier script. The way interview was written left it up for interpretation; was J. Nolan referring to final product or the earlier draft of the script?

Because Cooper Station and her sister stations are orbiting the Saturn, it is pretty sure to assume that they are here because of the wormhole - they have some plans for it, to go through at some point. Now, when Cooper arrives and the wormhole closes, it should have been a pretty big catastrophy for the WHOLE MANKIND. Yet the movie says nothing about that...? Like, in a way Cooper ruined their plans by popping out the hole and making it disappear.

And if the wormhole was closed, Cooper still goes to find Edmund's planet. Either Rangers on Cooper Station have the equipment needed to a)navigate in a vast universe and b)travel fast enough, or then Cooper just wants to make a slow suicide in a spacecraft alone in the deep, vast space. Because if Rangers aren't equipped with things that would get Cooper to Brand in a reasonable time, why bother going? It would be plain madness. You just don't "explore" randomly around the friggin' universe in hope that the planet you are looking for, just pops out. And I don't think Cooper was mad/crazy/suicidical...?

BUT if people on Cooper Station HAVE the technology and skills to get to the far side of the universe, for example to Edmund's planet, why would they be orbiting Saturn? Just for fun? Or just because there was (before Cooper arrived) a wormhole, for more-convenient means of travel. Meaning that they had the technology needed but still traveling through the wormhole was more convenient and faster.


Okay so those were my questions about situation where wormhole had closed.

In the novelization it clearly states that the wormhole is still OPEN. Now that confuses me - isn't novelization pretty "official" source of information? Like, you would think that the author confirmed those details to be correct before putting them into a book? Or is the novelization just some out-of-canon fanfiction?

Also, if you just look at the movie and nothing else, the wormhole being open-scenario would be more logical. Because it would explain why there wasn't any fuss about its disappearance, why Cooper so easily left in a Ranger etc.

In the novelization it says that people haven't yet gone to the other side of the wormhole because they have to be more prepared - human circadian rhytm and such, that the whole human civilization can't just come at once to a deserted planet that has no infrastructure etc. Sounds reasonable enough, and explains why Cooper doesn't want to wait and leaves immediately.

And for clearing things up: Brand arrives at Edmund's planet roughly at the same time as Cooper to the Cooper Station. The difference is like weeks or months, not decades. Also, that explains why people haven't yet gone through the wormhole, at least on a bigger scale, because only at the end of the movie they might be starting to receive the data Brand sends them. And old Murhp knows about Brand being there because he has the knowledge that Cooper has - Cooper himself sent her there. I think these are clear things for many, but not for all, that's why I thought to write them down too.

Oh, and some people thought that the film's starting scene, one with the crash, would actually be something from the future - like crashing on Brand's place. It's clear that in the scene it's not a spaceship and not a spacesuit, it's just normal pilot suit and helmet. I have paid great attention to the details in their suits and the scene doesn't have any deeper meaning. It's just the crash that happened on earth.

Yeah, but I'm kinda lost in here - what is the most official source for information and what is real? Or is there any solid knowledge? I don't want guesses, I want rock-solid truth

I don't think that things such as the script, interviews or the novelization should be supporting neccesarily the interpretation of this movie. The film stands on its own. You can interpret the script or some interviews but if you accept them as direct hints to the film than your point of view will be based on others one and regarding the lack of possibility for a discourse with these creators eventually you will be tossed away from the film itself. What I mean that every piece of art is having total idependency from its artist otherwise (if it needs further support) the materia loses its own purpose.

Minnie wrote:Now I've read almost all material available and still don't get the ending. Can you help me out?

...

Yeah, but I'm kinda lost in here - what is the most official source for information and what is real? Or is there any solid knowledge? I don't want guesses, I want rock-solid truth

There is a crucial small line in the actual movie that helps, many people miss it, and apparently it is even incorrectly transcribed on the blu-ray subtitles

When Cooper has recovered on Cooper Station, he is taken to his new home by a suited guy, on the way he sees the new rangers being loaded, the suited guy says "Oh Yeah, Brand"

The point is, that knowledge of what happened to Cooper and The Endurance mission is now common, and everyone on the station knows about it, even this lowly clerk showing Cooper to his home.

Everyone knows that Edmunds' planet is going to be their new home - but the preparations for the transport will take a while (and in the official book it even mentions huge mirrors being installed to replicate the day-night sunlight rhythm on Edmunds' planet)

Cooper aint gonna wait, he's going in the first wave, without permission, to reunite with Amelia and help start the new future for humans.

The suited guy says: "Oh yeah... right"

That was awesome.

caulfield wrote:The suited guy says: "Oh yeah... right"

just watched to verify. you are correct.

caulfield wrote:The suited guy says: "Oh yeah... right"

No he doesn't, he says. "Oh yeah, Brand"

(edit, and just in case you think the subtitles are reliable, checkout the scene when they land on Miller's planet and the subtitles transcribe the clearly spoken "130%" as "110%")