sorry that was kinda obnoxious to use that vid
but batfan is perhaps the most fascinating person on this forum
but batfan is perhaps the most fascinating person on this forum
Star Wars Universe Discussion Thread
B and it's been obvious for a long time now.m4st4 wrote:Two options...Batfan175 wrote:So I have a question for Star Wars fans: Darth Vader is a space Nazi who commits genocide and murders children without remorse. Why do so many people (including children) want to dress up like that fascist? And more importantly, why should we care about Anakin in shows like Star Wars The Clone Wars? Even if the character seemingly turns around in ROTJ it's just to save his own child, not to save the universe. That's still very selfish. Anakin, as shown in the Prequels even thinks like an authoritarian emo kid a lot of the time waaayyy before he officially turns to the Dark Side. He also feels justified murdering the Sand people (again, he murders women and children). To me it's a bit of a problem when people say 'oh here's Vader killing a bunch of nameless guys in Rogue One, he's so cool as he chokes people to death and swings his lightsaber around'. That should be creepy. Shouldn't the films actually address the kind of suffering he inflicts on others instead of either a) exclusively focusing on his emotional state or b) glossing over the fact that people are suffering at the hands of this guy? Why should we feel sad for this guy when he burns on Mustafar and why does the decision to throw the Emperor down a shaft change anything about any of his past actions?
a) you’re real... so my question is WHY?
b) you’re one of NF’s past treasures and this is all just a big exercise in trolling for you... so, again, my question is WHY?
Honestly Rogue One was bad and the prequels (which I liked) didn't do enough to really get us caring about Anakin; you're right, but the end of the original trilogy is symbolic. It's not Vader's actions at the end that redeem him, and it's not necessarily his redemption that's so important, it's the choice he makes within himself, and it's a symbol of hope in the sense that anyone can redeem himself. That's why you can buy the arc without needing to see the prequels. The prequels just provide lore but they don't add much at all to that redemption arc.Batfan175 wrote:So I have a question for Star Wars fans: Darth Vader is a space Nazi who commits genocide and murders children without remorse. Why do so many people (including children) want to dress up like that fascist? And more importantly, why should we care about Anakin in shows like Star Wars The Clone Wars? Even if the character seemingly turns around in ROTJ it's just to save his own child, not to save the universe. That's still very selfish. Anakin, as shown in the Prequels even thinks like an authoritarian emo kid a lot of the time waaayyy before he officially turns to the Dark Side. He also feels justified murdering the Sand people (again, he murders women and children). To me it's a bit of a problem when people say 'oh here's Vader killing a bunch of nameless guys in Rogue One, he's so cool as he chokes people to death and swings his lightsaber around'. That should be creepy. Shouldn't the films actually address the kind of suffering he inflicts on others instead of either a) exclusively focusing on his emotional state or b) glossing over the fact that people are suffering at the hands of this guy? Why should we feel sad for this guy when he burns on Mustafar and why does the decision to throw the Emperor down a shaft change anything about any of his past actions?
Posts: 55632
Joined:
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You and I have spent dozens upon dozens of hours surfing these boards, to me it’s a getaway into the whole industry world while also being a solid platform for discussion and occassional Kylo Ren outburst, but imagine spending all of your time here constructing nothing but pamphlets of word excercises that cover everything but ultimately amount to nothing. Such a curious, elaborate, social experiment. Batfan, I’d love to see the data when your done (Will it ever be? Is it your magnum opus?), especially on username m4. Like, how many times have I cursed. Or said I’m leaving NF. Details about my childhood traumas etc. You can add one more factor on your Venn diagram: I reeeeally like donuts.Allstar wrote:B and it's been obvious for a long time now.m4st4 wrote:Two options...Batfan175 wrote:So I have a question for Star Wars fans: Darth Vader is a space Nazi who commits genocide and murders children without remorse. Why do so many people (including children) want to dress up like that fascist? And more importantly, why should we care about Anakin in shows like Star Wars The Clone Wars? Even if the character seemingly turns around in ROTJ it's just to save his own child, not to save the universe. That's still very selfish. Anakin, as shown in the Prequels even thinks like an authoritarian emo kid a lot of the time waaayyy before he officially turns to the Dark Side. He also feels justified murdering the Sand people (again, he murders women and children). To me it's a bit of a problem when people say 'oh here's Vader killing a bunch of nameless guys in Rogue One, he's so cool as he chokes people to death and swings his lightsaber around'. That should be creepy. Shouldn't the films actually address the kind of suffering he inflicts on others instead of either a) exclusively focusing on his emotional state or b) glossing over the fact that people are suffering at the hands of this guy? Why should we feel sad for this guy when he burns on Mustafar and why does the decision to throw the Emperor down a shaft change anything about any of his past actions?
a) you’re real... so my question is WHY?
b) you’re one of NF’s past treasures and this is all just a big exercise in trolling for you... so, again, my question is WHY?
Posts: 4794
Joined:
January 2012
Yeah that makes sense. I didn't like Rogue One either and the fact that people cheer when the bad guy starts killing everyone wasjust a bit awkward. I mean, they get to enjoy seeing the bad guy kick everyone's ass and nostalgia does the rest. It just feels weird seeing everybody cheer at the appearance of the bad guy right after all the protagonists in that movie have died....I just in general found it odd why so much of Star Wars that was made after the OT revolved around the guy, especially considering that his one good choice at the end doesn't redeem him to me and Luke was the protagonist of the OT so his family ties to Luke are the only reason why he gets to be the protagonist of the Prequels as opposed to, say, Obi-Wan. That in itself is limiting the storytelling imo because there are so many potential stories to be told in the Star Wars universe, yet we're stuck with Anakin's family when he was not worth all the time and attention dedicated to him. If anything, the character exemplifies the power of marketing because, no matter what horrible stuff he does in the story of the film, people wanna dress up like him, etc. which is why Kylo Ren as an emo manchild works so well: he's a commentary on all those wannabe fanboys who think they're cool merely because they dress up like darth vader.anikom15 wrote:Honestly Rogue One was bad and the prequels (which I liked) didn't do enough to really get us caring about Anakin; you're right, but the end of the original trilogy is symbolic. It's not Vader's actions at the end that redeem him, and it's not necessarily his redemption that's so important, it's the choice he makes within himself, and it's a symbol of hope in the sense that anyone can redeem himself. That's why you can buy the arc without needing to see the prequels. The prequels just provide lore but they don't add much at all to that redemption arc.
Cilogy wrote:Batfan175 wrote:So I have a question for Star Wars fans: Darth Vader is a space Nazi who commits genocide and murders children without remorse. Why do so many people (including children) want to dress up like that fascist? And more importantly, why should we care about Anakin in shows like Star Wars The Clone Wars? Even if the character seemingly turns around in ROTJ it's just to save his own child, not to save the universe. That's still very selfish. Anakin, as shown in the Prequels even thinks like an authoritarian emo kid a lot of the time waaayyy before he officially turns to the Dark Side. He also feels justified murdering the Sand people (again, he murders women and children). To me it's a bit of a problem when people say 'oh here's Vader killing a bunch of nameless guys in Rogue One, he's so cool as he chokes people to death and swings his lightsaber around'. That should be creepy. Shouldn't the films actually address the kind of suffering he inflicts on others instead of either a) exclusively focusing on his emotional state or b) glossing over the fact that people are suffering at the hands of this guy? Why should we feel sad for this guy when he burns on Mustafar and why does the decision to throw the Emperor down a shaft change anything about any of his past actions?
Posts: 4794
Joined:
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Or, you, know, maybe this week a Star Wars film got released and I was thinking about the franchise as a whole and wondering why the space nazi who started out as a simple goon for the Empire became the centre of everything for everyone for a very long time with Star Wars and what that means?m4st4 wrote:You and I have spent dozens upon dozens of hours surfing these boards, to me it’s a getaway into the whole industry world while also being a solid platform for discussion and occassional Kylo Ren outburst, but imagine spending all of your time here constructing nothing but pamphlets of word excercises that cover everything but ultimately amount to nothing.Allstar wrote:B and it's been obvious for a long time now.m4st4 wrote: Two options...
a) you’re real... so my question is WHY?
b) you’re one of NF’s past treasures and this is all just a big exercise in trolling for you... so, again, my question is WHY?
Posts: 55632
Joined:
May 2010
You just basically confirmed it’s option a) and that’s just depressing, good luck.
I'll stick to this ranking.LelekPL wrote:1. Empire Strikes Back
2. The Last Jedi
3. Return of the Jedi
4. A New Hope
5. Revenge of the Sith
6. Force Awakens
7. Rogue One
8. Phantom Menace
9. Attack of the Clones
Although The Last Jedi has bigger highs than Empire. I just can't move it to number one because of some plot issues but overall I loved it.
1. Empire Strikes Back
2. A New Hope
3. The Last Jedi (could change on more viewings)
4. Force Awakens
5. Revenge of the Sith
6. Return of the Jedi
7. Rogue One
8. Phantom Menace
9. Attack of the Clones
2. A New Hope
3. The Last Jedi (could change on more viewings)
4. Force Awakens
5. Revenge of the Sith
6. Return of the Jedi
7. Rogue One
8. Phantom Menace
9. Attack of the Clones
