brutalA Borges man wrote: ↑December 1st, 2020, 7:47 pmAbsolutely nothing...critics hate it, Nolan's P.R. is in the shit, and audiences don't seem to like it. Think about how difficult it was for Nolan to rack up Oscars when he has got support from critics and audiences (looking at Memento, Dark Knight, Inception, Dunkirk).
Tenet - Awards Season Discussion Thread
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I wouldn't acknowledge this movie's dialogue as what gives it a good screenplay, but just the crafted story and inverted elements is pretty cleverly thought out personally.
Anyway, I do wonder how the RT score would change if every critic saw the film once, again a week or two later, and then left their review. I bet you'd convert at least half of those negative scores.
Should a movie have to be seen twice to give it a positive review?MuffinMcFluffin wrote: ↑December 2nd, 2020, 2:07 am
I wouldn't acknowledge this movie's dialogue as what gives it a good screenplay, but just the crafted story and inverted elements is pretty cleverly thought out personally.
Anyway, I do wonder how the RT score would change if every critic saw the film once, again a week or two later, and then left their review. I bet you'd convert at least half of those negative scores.
(it does play better a 2nd time, though)
-Vader
Definitely not.Vader182 wrote: ↑December 2nd, 2020, 2:12 amShould a movie have to be seen twice to give it a positive review?MuffinMcFluffin wrote: ↑December 2nd, 2020, 2:07 am
I wouldn't acknowledge this movie's dialogue as what gives it a good screenplay, but just the crafted story and inverted elements is pretty cleverly thought out personally.
Anyway, I do wonder how the RT score would change if every critic saw the film once, again a week or two later, and then left their review. I bet you'd convert at least half of those negative scores.
(it does play better a 2nd time, though)
-Vader
I still stand firm and pat on this, though: this movie is unfair to review the first time through. I make no assumption on whether first impression is positive or negative... I simply do not believe that one is able to properly absorb and take in what the movie attempts to offer you after just a single viewing.
I recorded a video driving home from Reno while trying to leave my impressions on the film (I still never uploaded it or did anything with it lol), and that's the only thing I kept saying. I couldn't rate it, rank it, say if I liked/disliked it, or anything of that nature. I had a headache (not because of the sound), and I obsessed over it. Then I saw it a second time about ten days later and I was able to evaluate it. It's not on the top of my Nolan films for sure, but most negative reviewers who are seeing this a second time are definitely turning their ships around, that's for sure.
I'm all for revisiting movies to gain expanded understanding and appreciation, but if a movie is that impossible to absorb over a single viewing, you've probably betrayed your audience.
-Vader
-Vader
To be fair, although I felt I could assess the movies at the time, a lot of my favorite all times films/songs etc. were not my favorites the first time experiencing them. In fact, I can't think of a single Nolan film where the first time I saw it was the best one. I actually leave his films underwhelmed to begin with, and they become massive growers. I think that's a good thing to me.
Remember, Bohemian Rhapsody (the song) and Fight Club weren't received as glowingly as they are today.
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I can understand your point. Although should a movie have to be seen once to give it a negative review completely? History of cinema has shown us that sometimes film assessment can be made from a very narrow minded perspective or vice versa. There’s no answer to that probably.
In any case, whether the movie gets a nomination or not, it shouldn’t diminish the experience of it. Not even the number of negative reviews have to be a detriment to it for those who like it. Nonetheless, constructive criticism remains important, in my opinion at least.
For every Fight Club, Blade Runner or The Shining are a 1000 movies that fade into obscurity every bit as bad as people thought they were at release. If a 200 million dollar movie is so impossibly esoteric that it can't be fairly reviewed on a single viewing by critics or the public, I really don't think anyone can say that the movie has succeeded in its primary goal to entertain.
Tenet may age well. It may not. Either way, I don't think it's reasonable to lay the burden of responsibility on critics and audiences to spend five hours watching a single movie for a "fair" reaction, and not on Nolan's feet for making Tenet the way he did.
And to repeat, I like Tenet. Good movie. I just don't think it's a reasonable mindset to rationalize the lukewarm response and presupposing it'll be a cult classic.
-Vader
Tenet may age well. It may not. Either way, I don't think it's reasonable to lay the burden of responsibility on critics and audiences to spend five hours watching a single movie for a "fair" reaction, and not on Nolan's feet for making Tenet the way he did.
And to repeat, I like Tenet. Good movie. I just don't think it's a reasonable mindset to rationalize the lukewarm response and presupposing it'll be a cult classic.
-Vader
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Well, I think people decide for themselves if they are willing to spend additional time trying to get more (assuming there is) from a film or not. It's their choice. Critics and audiences might give a movie another try if they think they should (or for whatever reason) which is the point of why there is probably no answer to that.Vader182 wrote: ↑December 2nd, 2020, 2:51 am
Tenet may age well. It may not. Either way, I don't think it's reasonable to lay the burden of responsibility on critics and audiences to spend five hours watching a single movie for a "fair" reaction, and not on Nolan's feet for making Tenet the way he did.
And to repeat, I like Tenet. Good movie. I just don't think it's a reasonable mindset to rationalize the lukewarm response and presupposing it'll be a cult classic.
-Vader
Nobody really knows if it’ll be a cult classic or not. Even if it doesn't in the end, it shouldn’t be an issue for some people because we all have preferences and particular tastes. Some people like it, some people don’t.
Just so we are clear..." Cult Classic" is a label that is not applicable to a movie that cost 200 million $ to make and had the whole Warner Brothers ad engine behind it. Cult classics are generally low budget or niche films and more often than not "transgressive", that somehow got an intense fan following, and will have rituals accumulated around it. Cult Classics include The Room, Rocky horror picture show, Phantom of the Paradise, or Pink Flamingos.Paradoxicalparabola wrote: ↑December 2nd, 2020, 3:06 amWell, I think people decide for themselves if they are willing to spend additional time trying to get more (assuming there is) from a film or not. It's their choice. Critics and audiences might give a movie another try if they think they should (or for whatever reason) which is the point of why there is probably no answer to that.Vader182 wrote: ↑December 2nd, 2020, 2:51 am
Tenet may age well. It may not. Either way, I don't think it's reasonable to lay the burden of responsibility on critics and audiences to spend five hours watching a single movie for a "fair" reaction, and not on Nolan's feet for making Tenet the way he did.
And to repeat, I like Tenet. Good movie. I just don't think it's a reasonable mindset to rationalize the lukewarm response and presupposing it'll be a cult classic.
-Vader
Nobody really knows if it’ll be a cult classic or not. Even if it doesn't in the end, it shouldn’t be an issue for some people because we all have preferences and particular tastes. Some people like it, some people don’t.
Tenet will go the way of things like Miami Vice, Blackhat, The fountain, Strange Days, or Prince of Darkness. A film by a major filmmaker, that the fans are obsessed with, but the people on the outside don't vibe with.
