[SPOILER] Discussion/Speculation Thread

Christopher Nolan's time inverting spy film that follows a protagonist fighting for the survival of the entire world.
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marshallmurphy
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Tarssauce wrote: ↑
September 5th, 2020, 9:42 pm
And that cold slam lol. The way the music stops...
Lol. Yes!!
Griffg63
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I just have to say im so happy Nolan made this film. Not only was it awesome but it gives us fans time to talk about this before his next film in a few years :lol: I loved dunkirk but it was a film you can only say so much about. Really enjoying the discussions on here
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666kalpa
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So Priya was already shot dead by the protagonist ..
then how come she work for an organization that will form only in the future if she is already dead in the present ?

Do we know exactly when she started working for TENET?
Demoph
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Ruth wrote: ↑
September 5th, 2020, 8:08 pm
 ^
Yeah. From the very beginning of the film, the mission is successful (since the Kiev opera siege happens on the 14th, so simultaneously as the Stalsk events and Vietnam, too). It’s signaled even earlier in the film by present Kat witnessing her own future self (ofc unknowingly) diving into the water. The Protagonist at some point says “doesn’t us being here now mean it [world destruction] never happened”, Neil gives him some sort of paradoxal explanation, but ofc he is ultimately right - it was all the correct path all along. Now the protagonist will just need to secure it remains that way by doing whatever he does (sending Neil back) at some point in the future. From the protagonist’s POV he’s not living in a loop, but overall i guess it makes sense to say the overall timeline of the events are?

So I assume the point of the temporal pincer attack is the same. The red team is already operating with the intel from the blue team, therefore blue team needs to invert back to not disturb any of this.
It’s likely way less fuzzy than we’re making it out to be, but the film doesn’t work in favor of making it seem easier to comprehend.
I don't think the mission is successful from the beginning, Neil is inverting from a future where the mission succeeded, yes. But the "what's happened, happened" doesn't seem like a necessity. The grandfather paradox implies that it is possible to undo what is.
So, they are protecting reality, and making sure that what happened still happen. The goal of Tenet is to avoid time paradox, and protect reality. So it's only because they succeed that we don't have time-paradox, and have a feeling of fatality, and impossibility to change the past.
Ruth
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The characters don’t know that they’re working on a successful path, for sure, other than perhaps Neil, but I doubt even he could know how every little detail would have to go down. But they’re operating within a single timeline, and in a way, reinforcing what’s already happened. It might be possible to undo things for the worse, but the characters end up pushing everything in the right direction regardless. We just don’t know that for sure until it happens. The protagonist for sure doesn’t know it. But it ends up tying right in.

Now whether or not things can truly be undone for the worse, is imo a question of free will existing or the paradox working. We can’t assume the characters are right about everything - we don’t truly know if the paradox works or if future people are correct to hope it won’t yeet everyone out of existence. So are we even sure free will exists to full capacity? The Protagonist inverts himself in Tallinn hoping to prevent Sator from getting the final algorithm piece during the car chase, but inadvertently ends up doing the opposite, despite his efforts. So I wonder if certain things cannot truly be altered as they’re set in stone as constants. So I wonder... even if the Protagonist had never inverted himself, the algorithm piece would have still found its way into Sator’s hands, just via different means.
I honestly don’t even know if what i’m saying makes any sense i’m just thinking out loud lmao
Demoph
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I'd say it's because he chose to inverse and go back to the chase that Sator got the 241. Even if he inverts in the future, as cause and consequence go, everything happening during the chase is in the present.
But, the all sequence in Tallin is the one I understand least, so I hope my third viewing will clarify.
I can't really even say, if talking about the movie like that, we're talking about important things as free-will and cause-consequence, or just about plot. It's hard to say when we're just filling the narrative gaps in the movie and when we're really going deep into the themes and understanding the character and the emotions...
I know many people say the conversations post-Tenet are less interesting than post-Inception, but I just don't know. I enjoy though that they're not so much based on just one object and one cut...
atwins
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Was able to see it this weekend and re:
How far in the future tenet was formed, my friends and I were laughing at the idea of inverted Neil just sitting in a shipping container for years
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DHOPW42
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Ruth wrote: ↑
September 6th, 2020, 5:09 am
The characters don’t know that they’re working on a successful path, for sure, other than perhaps Neil, but I doubt even he could know how every little detail would have to go down. But they’re operating within a single timeline, and in a way, reinforcing what’s already happened. It might be possible to undo things for the worse, but the characters end up pushing everything in the right direction regardless. We just don’t know that for sure until it happens. The protagonist for sure doesn’t know it. But it ends up tying right in.

Now whether or not things can truly be undone for the worse, is imo a question of free will existing or the paradox working. We can’t assume the characters are right about everything - we don’t truly know if the paradox works or if future people are correct to hope it won’t yeet everyone out of existence. So are we even sure free will exists to full capacity? The Protagonist inverts himself in Tallinn hoping to prevent Sator from getting the final algorithm piece during the car chase, but inadvertently ends up doing the opposite, despite his efforts. So I wonder if certain things cannot truly be altered as they’re set in stone as constants. So I wonder... even if the Protagonist had never inverted himself, the algorithm piece would have still found its way into Sator’s hands, just via different means.
I honestly don’t even know if what i’m saying makes any sense i’m just thinking out loud lmao
Of course it makes sense, and this is something I took away from the film on my fourth viewing yesterday.
To me it seems that the main purpose of Tenet (the organization) is to keep the time loop going on for... eternity, I guess. And, I think, there could be a way to fuck it all up, because Neil explains that the idea of "whatever happened, happened" doesn't mean you can just sit back and relax. Also, the scientist lady explains to the Protagonist that the bullet wouldn't move up to his hand unless he put his hand above it.

One of the key thoughts of the film is that ignorance is bliss, and it is the basic tenet of Tenet (yes). They are kept in the dark so that they wouldn't interfere with the time loop. The Protagonist is even used as a puppet by... his future self, I guess, when we see that he was meant to lose the algorythm to Sator. I don't mean it as a "fate" thing, but rather how these real events play out. Later, when the Protagonist goes up to Priya to make her warn his other self, Priya says that he cannot do that. This is a point, for example, where things could've been altered, but Priya is instructed - by the future Protanogist, unbeknownst to her - not to do that. They are meant to keep up the time loop, because that is the only way the algorythm is not activated.

Now, we could all try to figure out how the fuck this whole loop started in the first place, but it would miss the point, I think, and it couldn't be done. Is this a cheap narrative solution in all time travel films? Maybe. But here I give Nolan the benefit of the doubt, because the whole movie is built on the assumption that you cannot ever wrap your head around the physics of time. It just cannot be done. Nolan makes a film to prove that time doesn't work the way you think it works. Cause and effect doesn't work the way you would assume. The real workings of time are not reasonable from the point of view of a human being. It's like when Stephen Hawking explained that to ask what happened before the Big Bang would be missing the point. The film, I think, actually makes you realize that some of your questions won't work and that to some of the temporal mysteries of the film there could be no solution.

But I think the the plot itself works, because it seems like all the characters there go through this time loop, and Tenet (once again, the organization) helps them go through it again and again without any problems arising. That's the purpose of Tenet and the Protagonist. Neil, at the very end, goes back to die because he knows this is the only way the loop stays in place.
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lcbaseball22
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Wow, I'm guessing I'm late to the game on this but after seeing this mentioned in the "most helpful" IMDB review (see excerpt below, it's pretty interesting) I went searching for meaning and this is so cool! https://www.gamesradar.com/tenet-movie- ... her-nolan/
Disappointing at first watch, Masterpiece at second
shashthezarch26 August 2020
HEAVY MOVIE HINTS IN THE LAST PARAGRAPH. FOR THOSE WHO DIDN'T GET IT Its one hell of a complicated film. It will be very hard for an average viewer to gather all the information provided by this movie at the first watch. But the more you watch it, more hidden elements will come to light. And when you are able to put these hidden elements together. You will realize that this movie is just a "masterpiece" which takes the legacy of Christopher Nolan Forward

My humble request to everyone is to please let the movie sink in your thoughts. Let your mind grasp all the elements of this movie. I am sure more people will find it better. Even those who think they got the plot. I can bet they are wrong. Here is a little hint on how they can start to explore the film "SATOR - AREPO - TENET - OPERA - ROTAS" Its a latin palindrome. I got many answers, I hope others get it too.
X-MementoMori-X
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Could Laura (the female scientist played by Clemence Poesy) be the scientist, that invents inversion in the future? If I'm not wrong, Priya speaks about a female scientist.
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