[SPOILER] Discussion/Speculation Thread

Christopher Nolan's time inverting spy film that follows a protagonist fighting for the survival of the entire world.
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Oku
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Ruth wrote: ↑
August 27th, 2020, 6:56 am
Oku wrote: ↑
August 27th, 2020, 6:41 am
Ruth wrote: ↑
August 27th, 2020, 6:11 am

For me this is the big one that I can’t yet wrap my head around. And I think we bump into a paradox here?
If Kat witnesses herself jump in her recollections, then it means there’s only one timeline and certain things are already set in stone. So were we just witnessing things that had already happened? Meaning Sator doesn’t actually kill himself in the first place, but is always killed by Kat (hence him “disappearing”). How does he come back 10 days later then, to me, is quite paradoxal. If he is always killed by Kat on the 14th, then the Tallinn highway chase can’t really happen? Therefore the characters never have a reason to invert themselves to go back, and therefore, Kat doesn’t need to go back to 14th to stay with Sator if he was already dead 10 days earlier. At the same time all of it needs to happen for the events of the 14th to have happened. Bruh, what?
Am I really missing something or is my brain turning into a mush? I recognize the cyclical nature of the story. And it’s cool. I’m just wondering if I’m really just a moron or what
The Sator that Kat kills is present Sator.

So basically:
- past-Sator and past-Kat vacation in Vietnam. This is the happiest day of present-Sator's life, because Kat was nice to him and stuff. On day X of vacation, past-Sator leaves the yacht to go somewhere for business, and past-Kat and past-Max go ashore.
[...fast-forward...]
- present-Sator has all nine sections of the Algorithm. Now he just has to die. But he wants to re-live the happiest day of his life first.
- present-Kat knows this and goes back in time to day X and waits for present-Sator to arrive.
- present-Sator comes to day X, just as present-Kat predicted.
- present-Sator thinks that present-Kat is past-Kat, and falls for her niceness.
- present-Kat stops pretending, pulls out the gun, and points it at present-Sator.
- present-Sator thinks that this is past-Kat, and shows zero fear because he knows that past-Kat is not capable of murder.
- present-Kat reveals her abdomen gunshot wound. present-Sator realizes who she is and shouts in fear/anger. present-Kat kills him.
- present-Kat ties his corpse to her boat and sails away.
- past-Sator is still alive and continues on without knowing what happened.

Sorry if I misunderstood you and this is not what you were confused about.
But even in the past, Kat while leaving with her son in a boat, witnesses a woman jump off board. That is the PRESENT Kat, the one with (I assume) the abdomen wound, the one who kills Sator. Past Kat was witnessing something she would have to do in the future (or should I say, past), just half unknowingly as of then. I don’t remember us (nor past Kat) ever seeing Sator actually leave. This means the events of the film are cyclical, I am just perplexed as to why Sator would appear alive later on. Btw I’m not calling this a plot hole if this was a paradox left intentionally. I’m just wondering if I’m the only one thinking all of this and wondering
I don't understand XD
Yes, chronologically speaking, present-Sator died in the past. But past-Sator, who has no idea what just happened, will go on to become present-Sator and do the things that we saw in the movie. A loop, if you will.

It's the same as future-Neil being dead on the other side of that steel gate, while present-Neil is still alive and driving around a car a few hundred feet above his own corpse. At the end, he then boards the helicopter to go die at the steel gate.
Edit: oops, sorry:

quervo wrote: ↑
August 27th, 2020, 7:12 am
Intonestellar wrote: ↑
August 27th, 2020, 6:30 am
So Neil could be Max...? My head is gone! :D
No way.
I think yeah, if you wish, you can think that is the truth, because there's no proof for the opposite, but I highly doubt. Well, if Nolan thought about like that, there should have been an emotional moment where Kat and Neil first encounter, but there was none. So, I'm sure in Nolan's head Max is just the motivation for Kat to do what she does and Neil is "just" a super intelligent spy, and Protagonist met (will meet) him, because that is the path they should go on.
I'm not sure if these are references, but I thought about a movie and a TV-show while watching it at certain points.
Primer: Primer could be the very first film, where time travel worked like in Tenet, and they lived in a container while they were travelling back in time, just like Protagonist, Neil and Kat.
Doctor Who: Protagonist and Neil's friendship is like The Doctor and River Song's: for one of them the beginning is the end.
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Tarssauce
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Ruth wrote: ↑
August 27th, 2020, 6:56 am
But even in the past, Kat while leaving with her son in a boat, witnesses a woman jump off board. That is the PRESENT Kat, the one with (I assume) the abdomen wound, the one who kills Sator. Past Kat was witnessing something she would have to do in the future (or should I say, past), just half unknowingly as of then. I don’t remember us (nor past Kat) ever seeing Sator actually leave. This means the events of the film are cyclical, I am just perplexed as to why Sator would appear alive later on. Btw I’m not calling this a plot hole if this was a paradox left intentionally. I’m just wondering if I’m the only one thinking all of this and wondering
From what I understand
both Kat and Sator (on the yacht) are actually “time travellers” (yes Nolan I’m using this term so deal with it). Past Sator left on a helicopter. Present Sator went back to that moment. Present Kat pretends to be past Kat. She killed time travelling Sator but the other one exists probably in Kiev.

Past Kat will probably go through what present Kat went through. I’m guessing she hides till after Sator goes back to Vietnam and dies to reunite with her son.
It’s kinda complicated yet so brilliantly written and thought out.

One more thing...
I said Neil is Max but I might take that back. That could be just Nolan playing with us. But the reveal that he helped The Protagonist in Kiev and that he’s actually there to figure out what happens to actually warn older Protagonist about the whole is mind blowing. I thought the reveal that he dies saving the world but he actually goes back in time. He sees himself on both sides at the turnstile.
Can’t wait to get my hands on the screenplay - will be a fun read.
Ruth
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Ya sorry Oku, my brain farted and I totally forgot
Sator leaving in a helicopter bit lmao.
This checks out. Mind you guys I’ve only seen this once so far :lol:
Leigh
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It says in the film, that when you reverse time, you mustn't come in contact with your past self, or the results could be catastrophic. Yet this happens when JDW Washington fights himself wearing a swat outfit. So why weren't the results as bad as was warned when the Protagonist comes into contact with his past self?
Intonestellar
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It would be great if some very clever person could put the events of the film in some kind of chronological order,
does Opera scene actually happen after the ending? What about the motorway part?!
Ruth
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Leigh wrote: ↑
August 27th, 2020, 11:41 am
 It says in the film, that when you reverse time, you mustn't come in contact with your past self, or the results could be catastrophic. Yet this happens when JDW Washington fights himself wearing a swat outfit. So why weren't the results as bad as was warned when the Protagonist comes into contact with his past self?
I’d probably say it’s because the then present protagonist was unaware of who he was fighting at first? After he subdues the inverted self he wants to take his helmet off but Neil stops him.
mikedean
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my speculation on some of the questions for Tenet
What happened at opera scene?
protagonist from future gave his past self a mission to save the people there. future self pretends to be CIA to hide identity. terrorist are send by the russian guy. mysterious swat guy saves him is Robert Pattison. Everything is planned by his future self.

What is the point of Kats son?
The child is Robert Pattison. Max is also short for Maximilian, Maximillian or Maximiliaan (rooted from Maximilien in French). Maximilien backwords is Neilimixam or short for Neil. Play of words by Nolan
The Protagonist at the end of the film goes to become his mentor and best friend that train him for the big mission that we saw.

Why does russian guy have world destructive weapon?
when he was young humans from far future send it to him with a letter in a box with instructions on how to build it. He then build time machine and super algorithm bomb.
Why would the bomb activate when the Russian guy kills himself but it doesn't activate when he wife kill him?
Deadman switch set up so it activates when his heart stops after he takes the pill (which may or may not been set up by the protagonist in future). The wife didn't know if Protagonist deactivates the bomb before he dies but takes the chance in order not to give him final satisfaction.

why is the sound so loud?
Nolan wants to give a real sense of what gunshots feel like. His mentor was Michael Mann who directed "Heat" which also has annoyingly loud gun shots that feel very real and frightening.

who were the red and blue team fighting at the end and why do blue team fight inverted?
They are fighting the russian guys army that is protecting that base where the bomb is. They use inverted soldiers because the inverted have already seen what happened, because of this the inverted soldiers try to communicate the future to the normal soldiers like destroying certain buildings or pointing out certain things.
Last edited by mikedean on August 27th, 2020, 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Tarssauce
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Also he didn’t directly touch him as he was wearing a protective suit. They specifically mention particles (or was it molecules idk).
Ace
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Nice to see Jeremy Theobald (Following) cameo in the scene with Caine.

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Tarssauce
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Oh, yes! I was gonna say. I just noticed that it was him on my second viewing today. Blew my mind.
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