Dodd wrote:

TJ418 wrote: It only did 160 million this weekend . Balefan will comeback vindicated as Avengers won

that can't be right, source?

The numbers wont be released until tomarow night. Tonight hasn't even begun.

I have a question. Does Gotham know that Bruce was Batman, or is it assumed that Bruce Wayne died at some point during the war? I feel like this wasn't completely explained. On one hand, storywise/thematically, the people should know that Bruce (billionaire) was Batman, so it makes rebuilding all the more better and redeeming. On the other hand, if it's announced to the entire city that Bruce Wayne was Batman, it makes John Blake's new journey a little unrealistic, for we know that this "New Batman" is operating out of Wayne Manor, and "Batman", being illegal, would lead police straight to the Batcave.

This seems confusing and muddled to me (mostly because I myself don't get it). And if a statue of Batman is put up in memoriam, how would it make sense in the public eye for "Batman" to suddenly reappear with the signal again? I feel like Blake taking the mantle can't be realistic if everyone knows that Wayne was Batman.

So it comes down to a simple question: In the public eye, did Bruce Wayne die as Batman?

Only a select few knew Bruce was Bats . Hence Blake was frustrated by the fact that Bruce would not get his due for all his sacrifice .... . Pretty much the people at the funeral an Selena knew the truth at the end . At least that is all we know of

TJ418 wrote:Only a select few knew Bruce was Bats . Hence Blake was frustrated by the fact that Bruce would not get his due for all his sacrifice .... . Pretty much the people at the funeral an Selena knew the truth at the end . At least that is all we know of

So it's assumed that "Bruce Wayne" died at some random point during the war?

See, this is kind of sacrilegious to me. The whole point of this movie was riding on the ending of The Dark Knight: they lied about Harvey Dent. And there are consequences for their lie. And it all happens again. Bruce just fakes his death, and lies again to the people. I get it - it's controversial (Batman as a character is always controversial), but this doesn't seem like a happy ending to me. It seems like we're right back where TDK ended. This conspiracy is just as corrupt as lying about Dent.

What would stop another villain like Bane to come to Gotham and say, "Gotham! Batman is not dead! This statue is a lie! Bruce Wayne was Batman the entire time, and he LEFT YOU. This billionaire, this member of the 1%, has dedicated his adult life to helping the 99%, and now he's changed his mind. He fled Gotham and left you because he was selfish and no longer wanted to serve you! Instead, he's handed his legacy to this boy, this boy with no skills or experience. Is this who you want serving you? And worse yet, our Commissioner KNOWS. Our corrupt Commissioner, who knew about this, just as he knew about Harvey Dent. " --- It seems just as devastating to the city as exposing the Dent conspiracy.

Murphy528 wrote:

TJ418 wrote:Only a select few knew Bruce was Bats . Hence Blake was frustrated by the fact that Bruce would not get his due for all his sacrifice .... . Pretty much the people at the funeral an Selena knew the truth at the end . At least that is all we know of

So it's assumed that "Bruce Wayne" died at some random point during the war?

They probably assumed he was brought before Crane and chose either death or exile.

Murphy528 wrote:

TJ418 wrote:Only a select few knew Bruce was Bats . Hence Blake was frustrated by the fact that Bruce would not get his due for all his sacrifice .... . Pretty much the people at the funeral an Selena knew the truth at the end . At least that is all we know of

So it's assumed that "Bruce Wayne" died at some random point during the war?

Or was killed in one of the bombs that went off during the terrorist actions . There are so many reasons to believe he could have died there . He was driving on the bridge etccc

The more I think about it, the more I think the ending is exactly what happens in TDKR. Yes, that is what I said, but not the dark knight rises but the dark knight returns. In that comic, batman fakes his death and works in secret to forge his army to fight crime. Bruce is not done, but there are better ways for him to fight crime than putting on the mask and beating people up.

Murphy528 wrote:What would stop another villain like Bane to come to Gotham and say, "Gotham! Batman is not dead! This statue is a lie! Bruce Wayne was Batman the entire time, and he LEFT YOU. This billionaire, this member of the 1%, has dedicated his adult life to helping the 99%, and now he's changed his mind. He fled Gotham and left you because he was selfish and no longer wanted to serve you! Instead, he's handed his legacy to this boy, this boy with no skills or experience. Is this who you want serving you? And worse yet, our Commissioner KNOWS. Our corrupt Commissioner, who knew about this, just as he knew about Harvey Dent. " --- It seems just as devastating to the city as exposing the Dent conspiracy.

The last thing Batman did was stop the city being blown up by A NUCLEAR BOMB.

Whether he's alive or not is completely different to using a despicable murderer's name to create an act that denies parole to criminals, and duping a city into idolizing that murderer.

It's just like our own society though (thematically). The truth gets muddled. A typical Gotham citizen could say, "Okay, they lied about Dent, they lied about Batman being dead... Who's to say that Batman saving us from a nuclear bomb wasn't a lie too?" It would almost be easier for a new villain to undo everything done here than it was for Bane to undo everything from TDK. Manipulating this is so simple, it's like random internet weirdos distorting facts about 9/11 and Bush being in cahoots with Bin Laden's family, and so on. In this trilogy's universe, there's more than a dozen Gotham citizens who probably believe that Bane and the government were working together, or that Bane and Batman were on the same team, and it was to stage a tragedy to trick the people into peace.