[SPOILERS] TDKR Plot Speculation

The 2012 superhero epic about Batman's struggle to overcome the terrorist leader Bane, as well as his own inner demons.
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Fran wrote:
mchekhov wrote:
none of them left Ra's side when their temple was burning in Begins...


they were just as faithful to him as the men are to Bane...I think you're forgetting too many details
They did leave Ra's side actually. During the time Bruce and the decoy (Watanabe) are fighting, no one ever picked up Ra's and got him to safety. It was Bruce that saved him. But regardless, they were hardly in a position (nor in any part of Batman Begins) in which they sacrificed their lives like Bane's men did. One of those men accepted suicide long before the ploy, and the other willingly embraced it once Bane alluded to it.

If you still can't see the differences between the two groups, then I don't know what else to say. Clearly, one's more extreme than the other.


watanabe's decoy was willing to lay his life on the line to protect Ra's identity....and Ra's himself

how is that not laying his life on the line? He died protecting Ra's




and Miracle...thats a good observation...yes, the line is probably a double entendre

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mchekhov wrote:watanabe's decoy was willing to lay his life on the line to protect Ra's identity....and Ra's himself

how is that not laying his life on the line? He died protecting Ra's
It's not the same as committing suicide for someone or something. The decoy died in self-defense protecting Ra's which would be considered honorable. What the two henchmen did for Bane goes beyond honorable. It's radical.

Anyways, the argument isn't about the lack of loyalty or allegiance that the decoy had for Ra's. The argument is about the functionality of Bane's faction versus the LoS, and how one is more "extreme" than the other. Again, the LoS didn't commit suicide in Batman Begins. And Ra's never alluded to suicide as a dogma of the LoS either.
Last edited by Fran on January 27th, 2012, 1:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Fran wrote:
mchekhov wrote:watanabe's decoy was willing to lay his life on the line to protect Ra's identity....and Ra's himself

how is that not laying his life on the line? He died protecting Ra's
It's not the same as committing suicide for someone or something. The decoy died in self-defense protecting Ra's which would be considered honorable. What the two henchmen did for Bane goes beyond honorable. It's radical.

Anyways, the argument isn't about the lack of loyalty or allegiance that the decoy had for Ra's. The argument is about the functionality of Bane's faction versus the LoS, and how one is more "extreme" than the other. Again, the LoS didn't commit suicide in Batman Begins. Ra's never alluded to suicide as a dogma of the LoS either.

there never was a situation where he needed them to commit suicide though

i think there is no question about there being the same amount of loyalty...the men have the same principles

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MiracleSleeper wrote:I had this thought awhile ago... when Bane mentions how no one cared about him till he put on the mask, do you think his reference to the mask wasn't literal, but rather implying the persona he puts on that attracts followers to his cause?

I could imagine before he acted like the gung-ho revolutionary, no one really cared who he was, but when he pretended like he wanted to change society for the better, people rallied with him to join his cause. The more I think of this, the more it sounds like it could actually be accurate in the context of the situation.
I could definitely see this being the case, seeing how lines like that almost always have double meaning in Nolan films.

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Wasn't Ras' plan at the end of Begins a suicide mission? I've always thought he intended to die aboard that train.

Nolan's LoS have always reminded me of terrorist groups like Al-Qaeda.

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I think what TDKR will show is that the LoS have reached a new level. Like suicide-bombers they are now willing to die for their aims, and that's a much more terrifying for than were in BB.
Although the LoS were expertly trained and willing to die for their cause they weren't all out going and bombing places.

TDKR will be about a warzone on American soil.

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thedisabledcubicle wrote:I think what TDKR will show is that the LoS have reached a new level. Like suicide-bombers they are now willing to die for their aims, and that's a much more terrifying for than were in BB.
Although the LoS were expertly trained and willing to die for their cause they weren't all out going and bombing places.

TDKR will be about a warzone on American soil.
Warzone on American soil + terrorists + bombs + tension between social classes + economy issues + social uprising

Well, this film has "controversy" written all over it. I'm eagerly anticipating the dozens of bias and ignorant articles written following the release of this film.

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MiracleSleeper wrote:
thedisabledcubicle wrote:I think what TDKR will show is that the LoS have reached a new level. Like suicide-bombers they are now willing to die for their aims, and that's a much more terrifying for than were in BB.
Although the LoS were expertly trained and willing to die for their cause they weren't all out going and bombing places.

TDKR will be about a warzone on American soil.
Warzone on American soil + terrorists + bombs + tension between social classes + economy issues + social uprising

Well, this film has "controversy" written all over it. I'm eagerly anticipating the dozens of bias and ignorant articles written following the release of this film.
Thats only if Bane gives them permission to write about the film
"When art imitates life"
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Ending Revealed:

Bane has died, the doomsday device is set to go off and destroy all of Gotham, the controls are now in the hands of Talia. The device will only be turned off if Talia sees Batman break his one rule, he has to kill someone. Bane is the only one who knows of Batman's true identity, so Bruce uses that to his advantage and thinks of a plan. John Blake dresses up as Batman, and shoots Bruce Wayne, the most "hated" wealthy man in Gotham, dead. Talia believes Batman has finally did what it takes for true justice, and turns off the doomsday device. Bruce is now dead, and Talia believes that John Blake is Batman. Bruce therefore was able to successfully break his one rule, without having to kill anyone but himself. John Blake and Gordon are then able to arrest Talia, and both put Batman's suit to rest, and lets Batman's legacy live on, Gordon and Blake continue to help as the cops of Gotham.


;)
Last edited by MiracleSleeper on January 27th, 2012, 9:35 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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MiracleSleeper wrote:Ending Revealed:

Bane has died, the doomsday device is set to go off and destroy all of Gotham, the controls are now in the hands of Talia. The device will only be turned off if Talia sees Batman break his one rule, he has to kill someone. Bane is the only one who knows of Batman's true identity, so Bruce uses that to his advantage and thinks of a plan. John Blake dresses up as Batman, and shoots Bruce Wayne, the most "hated" wealthy man in Gotham, dead. Talia believes Batman has finally did what it takes for true justice, and turns off the doomsday device. Bruce is now dead, and it is believed that John Blake is Batman. Bruce therefore was able to successfully break his one rule, without having to kill anyone but himself.


;)
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