joal0503 wrote:
I would say that you are wrong. Mal and Cobb entered Limbo with a machine after slipping too deep into the levels. Granted they didn't know about Limbo then, they still could not differentiate the difference between reality and dream. The machine has NO effect on the user's awareness or ability to escape limbo. LIMBO IS LIMBO PERIOD. I
If avoiding the effects of limbo were as easy as going via machine, then the whole team would have just gone to limbo, instead of trying to avoid it the entire time.
Ok, your statement about Mal and Cobb not being able to differentiate Limbo from reality is incorrect. Cobb knew they were in a dream. Mal knew as well, at least at first. They just stayed there so long, that Mal began to accept it as her reality, in effect, she "chose to forget" that they were dreaming. But Cobb was aware. How else did he know that they needed to kill themselves to wake up?
And I don't get what you mean by this last sentence. They couldn't just "go to Limbo" because they had a job to do. They had mapped out a plan for performing inception Fischer, with different goals they would accomplish at different levels (for example, the hospital for Fischer to talk with his dad). How would going to Limbo help them do this?
I think I found my answer...
"Limbo can be entered by traveling deeper through the dream levels. After Fisher dies in the Mountain Dream, Cobb and Ariadne are able to enter Limbo by sleeping. The only reason this is possible is because, as Yusuf establishes earlier, the team cannot create more than three stable levels of dreams. Therefore, sleeping in Level 3 results in a sleeper dreaming themselves into Limbo. It should also be noted that manually entering Limbo allows a sleeper to retain the knowledge that they are dreaming, making it easier to avoid becoming 'lost' in Limbo."
Thats from the Wiki and follows your train of thinking....
But I had always thought that they "accidentally" entered Limbo, didnt know it, and then after a bit Cobb realized it and performed the inception to escape...
Going to Limbo wouldnt help the plan. I was alluding the to fact that the fear the team expresses towards limbo seems trivial, if they can simply avoid the effects with the dream machine.
Anita18 wrote:
Yes, the purpose of showing Saito being so old in limbo is to show how long he's been down there and how his mind is surely lost. The details are not explained, so we have to figure out what might have happened given the information shown in the movie.
Someone asked a question, and I gave the OP my theory with some proof. Cobb is shown to have the ability to gauge approximately how long he's been in a dream even when he's been in one for a long time. The argument between the group about limbo could have stressed him out (since everyone was accusing him) and he didn't want to bother correcting Yusuf to exacerbate the whole issue. Besides, Nolan probably didn't want to drop the "50 years in limbo with Mal" info until Cobb is explaining the whole story to Ariadne later. Remember, this is just a story, Nolan is constructing this to his liking.
Anyhows, it's no biggie whether I'm "right" or not. It's just my theory. It's certainly no worse than people thinking that Cobb is in a dream for the entire movie, when there is actual visual proof to the contrary.
I just want to know how the hell Cobb ended up re entering Limbo (if he had died in Limbo he would have returned to reality...right?...) ... or how he went from the skyscraper to the beach...
Cobb: "We were exploring the concept of a dream within a dream. I kept pushing things, I wanted to go deeper and deeper. I just didn't understand the concept that hours could turn into years...we could get trapped so deep that we wound up on the shore of our own subconscious, we lost sight of what was real. We created, we built a world for ourselves. We did that for years... Eventually, it just became impossible for me to live like that... she had locked something away, something deep inside her. The truth that she’d always known but chose to forget. Limbo became her reality."
I'm pretty sure that explanation makes it sound like they accidentally got there, and they didn't know at first, but he realized it and couldnt live like that anymore, thus performing the inception to convince Mal.
I just dont think that they would knowingly stay down in limbo for "something like 50 years" voluntarily...if they were truly "stuck" in limbo for that long, they would not have known it was limbo?...But it definitely does make it seem like Cobb was aware they were in limbo...Im so confused now.
joal0503 wrote:I just want to know how the hell Cobb ended up re entering Limbo (if he had died in Limbo he would have returned to reality...right?...) ... or how he went from the skyscraper to the beach...
Well when everyone else was kicked back up to level 1, they were still heavily sedated, and would be for a heck of a long time. When you die while heavily sedated, you don't wake up, you go to limbo. I think most of us have agreed that when you die in limbo, you are "reset" in limbo until the sedative wears off. Or find yourself washed up on a beach in limbo, again. Which is actually pretty likely, considering we see multiple people washed up on a beach in limbo in the film...it's probably limbo's front door.
joal0503 wrote:I'm pretty sure that explanation makes it sound like they accidentally got there, and they didn't know at first, but he realized it and couldnt live like that anymore, thus performing the inception to convince Mal.
I just dont think that they would knowingly stay down in limbo for "something like 50 years" voluntarily...if they were truly "stuck" in limbo for that long, they would not have known it was limbo?...But it definitely does make it seem like Cobb was aware they were in limbo...Im so confused now.
Cobb makes it sound like he was lost for a while, then eventually realized that they were living in a dream world and refused to leave without convincing Mal to go with him.
Or he's a selfish SOB who's okay with leaving his kids and playing God in a dream world instead.
joal0503 wrote:Going to Limbo wouldnt help the plan. I was alluding the to fact that the fear the team expresses towards limbo seems trivial, if they can simply avoid the effects with the dream machine.
They're afraid of dying and going into limbo, which is what you alluded to. Since level 1 is so militarized, their biggest fear is being killed and falling into limbo that way.
jr724 wrote:Saito is much older because he died in the 3rd level before Cobb and Ariadne went down
Just watched Inception last night, and have been rewatching bits and pieces to sort things out (more on this elsewhere), but I thought I'd point out that this isn't true. The sequence of events is:
1. Ariadne and Cobb go to Limbo
2. They search for Fischer and Mal
3. While this is happening, Eames is setting the charges while Saito holds them off by firing into the shortcut vent and throwing a grenade in there
4. Then Saito dies
Leaving aside the question of how Cobb got from the Limbo house to the shoreline, I think Saito was so much older because he didn't realize it was a dream, and his mind had become lost and experienced time much faster before Cobb found him.
"Limbo can be entered by traveling deeper through the dream levels. After Fisher dies in the Mountain Dream, Cobb and Ariadne are able to enter Limbo by sleeping. The only reason this is possible is because, as Yusuf establishes earlier, the team cannot create more than three stable levels of dreams. Therefore, sleeping in Level 3 results in a sleeper dreaming themselves into Limbo. It should also be noted that manually entering Limbo allows a sleeper to retain the knowledge that they are dreaming, making it easier to avoid becoming 'lost' in Limbo."
Thats from the Wiki and follows your train of thinking....
But I had always thought that they "accidentally" entered Limbo, didnt know it, and then after a bit Cobb realized it and performed the inception to escape...
Going to Limbo wouldnt help the plan. I was alluding the to fact that the fear the team expresses towards limbo seems trivial, if they can simply avoid the effects with the dream machine.
i was thinking the same thing.
"All this 'good vs evil' shit's been played out. It's now time for 'BAD VS. EVIL'
joal0503 wrote:Nope. That would negate all of the negative fear that the rest of the team (as well as the whole incident with Mal) has experienced. If they simply had to know about Limbo to evade it's power then they wouldn't care so much about not dying, slipping too far, etc...
When you enter limbo consciously, you know that you are in it. If you died and fell into it, then you wouln't. Limbo isn't a problem unless you die, because you won't be aware of entering it and you will take it to be reality, unlike Cobb and Ariadne were when the hooked themselves up to the PASIV device.
Remember, this is just a story, Nolan is constructing this to his liking.
