prince0gotham wrote:The "genetic disorders" argument against incest is a bad one, all there is is a slightly increased risk of genetic disorders and we only all know that because incest is already a taboo.

Why should mechanisms to avoid incest be so widespread both in nature and across human societies? The answer is simple. The problem with having sex close with relatives is that there is an astonishingly high chance that your offspring will be born with a serious birth defect. Take the results of a study of Czechoslovakian children whose fathers were first degree relatives. Fewer than half of the children who were the product of incestuous unions were completely healthy. Forty-two percent of them were born with severe birth defects or suffered early death and another 11 percent were mildly mentally impaired. This study is particularly instructive as it included a unique control group — the offspring of the same mothers but whose fathers were not the mothers’ relatives. When the same women were impregnated by a non-relative, only 7 percent of their children were born with a birth defect.

A group of genetic counselors reviewed the research on the biological consequences of sex between relatives (consanguineous relationships). They found a surprisingly small increase (about 4 percent) in birth defects among the children of married cousins. Incest between first degree relatives, however, was a different story. The researchers examined four studies (including the Czech research) on the effects of first degree incest on the health of the offspring. Forty percent of the children were born with either autosomal recessive disorders, congenital physical malformations, or severe intellectual deficits. And another 14 percent of them had mild mental disabilities. In short, the odds that a newborn child who is the product of brother-sister or father-daughter incest will suffer an early death, a severe birth defect or some mental deficiently approaches 50 percent.

prince0gotham wrote:The "genetic disorders" argument against incest is a bad one, all there is is a slightly increased risk of genetic disorders and we only all know that because incest is already a taboo. I mean that we're prone to examine things we already consider taboo and figure out the risks and not examine or think too much about the risks in things we don't condemn. Each one of us is genetically predisposed to certain diseases or conditions and the partners we mate with always complicate one way or another, so it's just silly to think like there's a night and day difference between incest and non-incest biologically.

It's even sillier to think there's a moral difference. Society creates taboos out of everything it's not yet ready to deal with and unlike other things the concept and values of "family" are still too sacred in most cultures so we just let them be challenged. Besides, I'm sure that many confuse the issue of morality with the fact that they just can't imagine being attracted to a family member. I mean, we perceive relatives in much more complex ways than everyone else so that alone makes it completely impossible for me and most people to get turned on by a relative, but some just mistake the statistics/probabilities of it with whether it's normal or moral or wrong or anything. In the first place, even when we do what most of us do, which is seek partners outside of family, we're still always looking for a compromise between the unknown (that's filled with the potentialities of difference) and the familiar ("family"?). So if we always end up fucking versions of our relatives anyway how immoral is the real thing really? And I bet it goes the other way around as well, I guess some parents can get turned on by their children because they look like younger versions of their partner, or a sister can get turned on by her brother because he's like a younger version of her father (that's like a notch more acceptable isn't it?), not necessarily because that's perverted.

Of course non-consent and illegal age-difference are a problem, but we should be honest with ourselves. There's a difference between a taboo and "a problem". One is literal and concrete and the other is bloated by the misconceptions of people who don't want to talk literal and concrete, distance and fence themselves from confronting the issue.

PS: and "oh, and what if everyone just started doing it, what will it come to then???" is another bad argument too so watch out

m4st4 wrote:Never thought we'd see this, not even on NolanFans.

Are we cats?

We are most definitely not cats.

Guys... I'm off to see Pirates, fuck this bs.

Master Virgo wrote:If a person's action has no negative effect on the world and its inhabitants, it can not possibly be immoral.

ChristNolan wrote:I'm going to assume you didn't see my post. Theres no way you can say that shite with a straight face when science has already shown that there is most definitely a negative effect with incestual breeding. This isn't even a question of morals. It's observable and tangible.

Master Virgo wrote:

ChristNolan wrote:I'm going to assume you didn't see my post. Theres no way you can say that shite with a straight face when science has already shown that there is most definitely a negative effect with incestual breeding. This isn't even a question of morals. It's observable and tangible.

Oh my God, you are right. I just checked and apparently you can't possibly love someone without making babies with them. You are quite a genius aren't you?£

The "genetic disorders" argument against incest is a bad one, all there is is a slightly increased risk of genetic disorders and we only all know that because incest is already a taboo.

Each one of us is genetically predisposed to certain diseases or conditions and the partners we mate with always complicate one way or another, so it's just silly to think like there's a night and day difference between incest and non-incest biologically.

Master Virgo wrote:

ChristNolan wrote:I'm going to assume you didn't see my post. Theres no way you can say that shite with a straight face when science has already shown that there is most definitely a negative effect with incestual breeding. This isn't even a question of morals. It's observable and tangible.

Oh my God, you are right. I just checked and apparently you can't possibly love someone without making babies with them. You are quite a genius aren't you?£