@Cooldude

Thanks. The conflict between the two nations is definitely a subject I would like to study about.

Because otherwise the US would have no influence in the Middle East whatsoever because these countries don't want to give up their tribal cultures in favour of one readily marketed consumer culture that is shallow and does not have anything of depth to offer intellectually or spiritually.

Batfan175 wrote:Because otherwise the US would have no influence in the Middle East whatsoever because these countries don't want to give up their tribal cultures in favour of one readily marketed consumer culture that is shallow and does not have anything of depth to offer intellectually or spiritually.

Hmm... not really. It's the other way around.

The consumer culture you're talking about it's not the problem at all, nor is the point of all of this. Especially when you consider how better it is for our modern society in comparison to the tribal culture. Because like you said it yourself... it's tribal.

As for why United States supports Israel... it's not because without Israel they wouldn't have any influence in the Middle East. It's simply because without Israel there would be no United States. That's basically it. But soon, soon enough, don't act surprised if you'll see Israel fall at the hands of United States. It's only logical for it to happen one day. Only question is when... and who will decide upon it? Who will benefit from it?

Batfan175 wrote:Because otherwise the US would have no influence in the Middle East whatsoever because these countries don't want to give up their tribal cultures in favour of one readily marketed consumer culture that is shallow and does not have anything of depth to offer intellectually or spiritually.

This disgusting tribal and isolationist mentality we arabs have has caused us nothing but suffering and wars and continues to. It’s dangerous and further encourages and sustains cultural heterogeneity and diminishes the hegemony of a single entity. Arabs are far weaker in their disunity. Israel can fly into Lebanon every day as it wishes because Lebanon is weak and small. Israel can send planes to spy on Syria whenever it wants because Syria is corrupt and weak. Israel can bomb the Palestinians whenever they want because they are small and weak. They can steal water from Jordan because Jordan is weak and small. We work better when we’re united but Arabs have zero-long term thinking capability at the moment.

And we fucking rely on everything from A to Z on the West - we are pure (in every sense) consumerist societies. The current combined revenue from exports in the Arab League is about 1.2 - 1.3 Trillion. This places us in the top 4 with China, US, and Germany. Yet we have no infrastructure of sustainable industry to show for. It’s embarrassing… all we’re good at is building empty skyscrapers, ugh.

RIFA wrote: As for why United States supports Israel... it's not because without Israel they wouldn't have any influence in the Middle East. It's simply because without Israel there would be no United States. That's basically it. But soon, soon enough, don't act surprised if you'll see Israel fall at the hands of United States. It's only logical for it to happen one day. Only question is when... and who will decide upon it? Who will benefit from it?

Exactly, the Israeli government’s behaviour reflects negatively on US (international credibility and influence) and the US knows this. A lot of the US’ support for Israel are essentially bribes to tone down Israel belligerent action (than it already is) so it won’t completely harm US interests. For instance, look at the enormous amount of resources (not including the annual military aid they already receive from the US) that is handed to Israel so they feel ’secure’ enough not to attack Iran and damage US interests in the process. If the US had its way, Israel would be forced to pull out on all the settlements and there would be a sovereign Palestinian state ruled by a pro-US regime. The problem is that no US administration has the domestic political support to force Israel to be serious on making peace.

cooldude wrote:

Batfan175 wrote:Because otherwise the US would have no influence in the Middle East whatsoever because these countries don't want to give up their tribal cultures in favour of one readily marketed consumer culture that is shallow and does not have anything of depth to offer intellectually or spiritually.

This disgusting tribal and isolationist mentality we arabs have has caused us nothing but suffering and wars and continues to. It’s dangerous and further encourages and sustains cultural heterogeneity and diminishes the hegemony of a single entity. Arabs are far weaker in their disunity. Israel can fly into Lebanon every day as it wishes because Lebanon is weak and small. Israel can send planes to spy on Syria whenever it wants because Syria is corrupt and weak. Israel can bomb the Palestinians whenever they want because they are small and weak. They can steal water from Jordan because Jordan is weak and small. We work better when we’re united but Arabs have zero-long term thinking capability at the moment.

And we fucking rely on everything from A to Z on the West - we are pure (in every sense) consumerist societies. The current combined revenue from exports in the Arab League is about 1.2 - 1.3 Trillion. This places us in the top 4 with China, US, and Germany. Yet we have no infrastructure of sustainable industry to show for. It’s embarrassing… all we’re good at is building empty skyscrapers, ugh.

RIFA wrote: As for why United States supports Israel... it's not because without Israel they wouldn't have any influence in the Middle East. It's simply because without Israel there would be no United States. That's basically it. But soon, soon enough, don't act surprised if you'll see Israel fall at the hands of United States. It's only logical for it to happen one day. Only question is when... and who will decide upon it? Who will benefit from it?

Exactly, the Israeli government’s behaviour reflects negatively on US (international credibility and influence) and the US knows this. A lot of the US’ support for Israel are essentially bribes to tone down Israel belligerent action (than it already is) so it won’t completely harm US interests. For instance, look at the enormous amount of resources (not including the annual military aid they already receive from the US) that is handed to Israel so they feel ’secure’ enough not to attack Iran and damage US interests in the process. If the US had its way, Israel would be forced to pull out on all the settlements and there would be a sovereign Palestinian state ruled by a pro-US regime. The problem is that no US administration has the domestic political support to force Israel to be serious on making peace.

This was a fascinating read, thank you.

Cilogy wrote: This was a fascinating read, thank you.

Rohan wrote:@Cooldude

Thanks. The conflict between the two nations is definitely a subject I would like to study about.

mchekhov 2: Chek Harder wrote:Props to cooldude for his contributions to the israel/palastine thread. Not saying i'm informed but now I at least don't know nothing about the issue lol

Well, I’m glad I was able to give you guys an insight or at least some sort of an understanding of the conflict from an Arab/Palestinian standpoint. Anyway, anyone that is interested in the topic I highly recommend watching The Promise, a four part British mini-series on the conflict set in two different time periods. From a British soldier's point of view, his involvement in the final years of Palestine under the British mandate and his modern day granddaughter visiting Israel. For the most part I thought the series was a well-balanced effort and does a genuine attempt to explain the conflict. And the information, I thought, was presented in an accurate way. There were no ‘really’ moments of inaccuracy. A must watch to anyone interested in the subject. The whole series can be found on youtube.

http://www.wjla.com/articles/2014/07/is ... 05029.html

I just give up.

So Israel prime-minister basically said that he doesn't care what is the US position lawl.

Israel-US relations are getting tense.

Question is... how scared is US of Israel?

Every act of aggression by Israel (in response to the rockets) strengthens the Hamas position that they can only defend the idea of Palestine by force. And every Palestininan who dies due to Israeli missiles becomes a martyr and a catalyst for even more people to join Hamas. And the more attacks by Hamas on Israel (be it suicide bombings or rockets), the stronger the hawks in the Israeli Govt become and their military operations on the Gaza Strip become more elaborate. A vicious cycle indeed.

Hamas also proves again and again that they're nothing but bunch of cowards, who hide in their holes when it comes to war. Folks of Hamas, lawyers, doctors, educated as they are, still dream of a world and its map to be without Israel, which will never happen. Militarily Hamas is weak. What's going on currently, Israel is not to be blamed for it, but Hamas and Hamas only. I wonder why the Palestinians don't RISE against HAMAS.

Shit, why am I even posting about this? Their conflict won't end. Never.

Good night!