Joker (2019)

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Bacon wrote:
October 3rd, 2019, 6:20 pm
I've honestly heard nothing but good things from most critics that I care about, so I'm a little shocked to see the RT/MC drop so low. Is it really because of the controversy behind it?

Seeing this Tuesday most likely.
That and critics are mad at Phillips for his comments.

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can we not pollute the forum with that toxic and invalid bullshit please


-Vader

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It’s true. You don’t go from getting raved at Venice to the Golden Lion to this, it’s unprecedented. There is an obvious agenda that goes beyond the film itself. Even Rodrigo Perez admitted critics had their knives out at his screening. So no, commenting on something so obvious is not “toxic”.

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it got *very divisive* reviews out of Venice and RT scores typically drop over time...


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Vader182 wrote:
October 3rd, 2019, 6:33 pm
it got *very divisive* reviews out of Venice and RT scores typically drop over time...


-Vader
It had like an 8.8 average rating and a Golden Lion but sure. Also, never seen anything drop like this. If you think this is normal and there isn’t more to this...I dunno what to say.

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youve never seen a movie drop 11% on rotten tomatoes and about 1 point avg rating?

ok

PS, the golden line is not overtly prestigious. look at previous winners. thank you.


-Vader

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I think people are focusing on the Golden Lion so much more now since the winners for the past two years were Shape of Water and Roma. Both went on to have really successful awards campaigns and have garnered a lot of respect and prestige. People like patterns no matter how long and short basically.

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The metacritic went from a 75 to 58 as well. The % went from 88 (with 50 something reviews, all Venice) to 69. Avg. rating down 1.5 points.

I liked when you weren’t a fan of overly politicizing art (which critics are doing here) but seems you hopped on the bandwagon.

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lucrecia martel is no joke

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Artemis wrote:
October 3rd, 2019, 6:45 pm
I think people are focusing on the Golden Lion so much more now since the winners for the past two years were Shape of Water and Roma. Both went on to have really successful awards campaigns and have garnered a lot of respect and prestige. People like patterns no matter how long and short basically.
yes, recency bias

both years (2017 and 2018) had very slim pickings (usual for Venice), and those were "Great" movies that happened to go to the festival out of maybe 2 or 3 tops.

What were they going to pick over Roma, Vox Lux? Not to mention, last year GDT was jury president! of course he picked roma lol.

joker won over marriage story this year, which as i keep repeating on this forum, lacks an 'award hook" so it's unlikely it'll win stuff.

golden lion doesn't actually mean anything, so citing it like allstar is doing is either ignorance or deliberately misconstruing facts to fit a "narrative" against critics, which is exactly what he's accusing critics of doing to joker...
Allstar wrote:
October 3rd, 2019, 6:47 pm
The metacritic went from a 75 to 58 as well. The % went from 88 (with 50 something reviews, all Venice) to 69. Avg. rating down 1.5 points.

I liked when you weren’t a fan of overly politicizing art (which critics are doing here) but seems you hopped on the bandwagon.
It's being treated as a political object because...it is one? Is that a bandwagon? Aside from the "all art is innately political" part of this dialogue, Joker is a political movie about a disenfranchised white nobody who lashes out at the world around him and gains notoriety. Coming out in a country with a massive unlegislated* problem for people exactly like him.

People are reacting to that. Which, you know, is the job of critics.

And yes, there's been many dozens of movies to get hyped by a group of a few dozen critics then when you get a massively bigger sample size the numbers change. Some of Joker's most glowing reviews have been added in the last 7 days.


-Vader

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