The Batman (2022)

All non-Nolan related film, tv, and streaming discussions.
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DHOPW42 wrote:
April 11th, 2020, 10:26 am
But if he would do that, wouldn't he just retire the Batman persona and devote his enormous wealth to transform Gotham with modern infrastructure, jobs, investments, charities, etc...?
No, because the Batman persona is the end result of Bruce overcoming the trauma. It's his chosen profession, and a healthy way to deal with crime and injustice (in comic books). He can and does invest his resources into transforming Gotham socially and economically. It's just that he does it while simultaneously being the Batman. Part of it may be the personal component, in that he wants to be directly involved with the crimefighting as a result of his past. Part of it is the whole "being a symbol" thing. Of course, for the sake of telling a fictional comic book story, the Batman persona has to be around for some kind of reason.

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The guy who goes out at night, and beats the bejesus out of a bunch of psychologically disturbed people, has very clearly not overcome shit.

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Those "psychologically disturbed people" are criminals, and the Batman is a crimefighter.

And he doesn't "beat them up", he uses his fighting skills to aid in stopping their crimes and defending himself.

It's all a part of the job.

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taopaipai wrote:
April 11th, 2020, 6:34 pm
Those "psychologically disturbed people" are criminals, and the Batman is a crimefighter.

And he doesn't "beat them up", he uses his fighting skills to aid in stopping their crimes and defending himself.

It's all a part of the job.
He most definitely "beats them up," and vigilantism is typically perpetuated by unstable people, which Batman most definitely is.

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Numbers wrote:
April 11th, 2020, 7:31 pm
He most definitely "beats them up," and vigilantism is typically perpetuated by unstable people, which Batman most definitely is.
If the Batman is unstable, then so is Superman, Spider-Man, Daredevil etc. They are all vigilantes. That doesn't make them unstable or troubled.

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taopaipai wrote:
April 11th, 2020, 8:19 pm
Numbers wrote:
April 11th, 2020, 7:31 pm
He most definitely "beats them up," and vigilantism is typically perpetuated by unstable people, which Batman most definitely is.
If the Batman is unstable, then so is Superman, Spider-Man, Daredevil etc. They are all vigilantes. That doesn't make them unstable or troubled.
yes

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Numbers wrote:
April 12th, 2020, 6:42 am
taopaipai wrote:
April 11th, 2020, 8:19 pm
Numbers wrote:
April 11th, 2020, 7:31 pm
He most definitely "beats them up," and vigilantism is typically perpetuated by unstable people, which Batman most definitely is.
If the Batman is unstable, then so is Superman, Spider-Man, Daredevil etc. They are all vigilantes. That doesn't make them unstable or troubled.
yes
Superman seems rather well-adjusted, as does Spider-Man. Batman is a troubled individual who seems to want to spend time thinking about his own misery rather than moving on from it. That's the difference. For all that people saying how competent Batman is there is also a case to be made that he's just a big child who never went to therapy and is just centering his entire life around that one point of his life and in that regard he's not dealing with the tragedy in his life in a healthy way because it serves as an excuse for him to beat up poor people.

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If one filmmaker wanted to portray Batman the way taopaipai imagines it, then of course it could be done, I mean... once you got the rights to do a Batman story, you can do anything :D But I think what's missing here is that most filmmakers - screenwriters, directors and actors - wouldn't overlook the obivously ambiguous nature of Batman's methods and whole existence. He is a billionare who developed a secret vigilante persona taking justice in his own hands - thinking that this way he would save Gotham. Whereas in reality all it would take is to invest his enormouos wealth in the true transformation of society with the foundation of education centers, building infrastructure, giving to charities, researching the cure of cancer, etc. And he is not doing that - he is investing his wealth into hyper military gadgets, military vehicles and whatnot.

Also... we are still seeing Batman comics. Gotham has never been saved, in spite of Batman's "best" efforts - which are, in fact, not his best efforts, but he doesn't realize that. Because he, in a way, is problematic. And good filmmakers and writers must see this.

You could come up with a happy Batman but I think that would miss much of the psychological detail that makes him an interesting - and different - character.

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taopaipai wrote:
April 11th, 2020, 2:59 am
He dealt with the trauma as a child, and by the time he became an adult he had put it behind him to become the Batman. I would rather see this than yet another Batman haunted by the past or struggling psychologically or whatever.

Maybe instead have a Batman that actually enjoys being the Batman and working towards a brighter future.
But... Why would Batman 'enjoy' being Batman. He's out there as long as Gotham is turning to shit... Why would he... Enjoy that.

And first you said he overcame his trauma as a grownup... But then you mention 'yet another brooding Batman'. Perhaps there's a reason he's like that in all of media... Perhaps that's the essence of the character, that he did not, in fact, overcame his parents' death. That is his driving force and a staple character trait.

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m4st4 wrote:
April 12th, 2020, 6:01 pm
But... Why would Batman 'enjoy' being Batman. He's out there as long as Gotham is turning to shit... Why would he... Enjoy that.
Because he likes justice. He gets to put his abilities and resources to good use. He finds it worthwhile to stop crime and save people. Plus he's honoring his parents' memory.

m4st4 wrote:
April 12th, 2020, 6:01 pm
Perhaps that's the essence of the character, that he did not, in fact, overcame his parents' death. That is his driving force and a staple character trait.
Nah, the essence of the character is his commitment to justice and the war on crime. That's what drives him. His parents death was just the spark. If he had never moved past it, he would never have become the Batman. The idea that Batman never overcame his childhood trauma and is struggling psychologically only became as popular as it did because of the post-Miller and post-Burton stories that took off in the 90s. While it may have been used prior to that era, it was never the essence of the character, and it's a trait that can easily be excluded if a writer so chooses.

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