Star Wars Universe Discussion Thread

All non-Nolan related film, tv, and streaming discussions.
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LelekPL wrote:The one that made me stop and rethink the most was Attack of the Clones. They had a pretty good film on their hands. But Hayden failed them miserably. If only he had been a completely sympathetic character for the most part of the film. If he was fun, enthusiastic and not an angsty teen, his turn would have been much better. They could have kept his mother's death and his turn the same way. But it would have been a 1000% more impactful had he been a true likable hero by that point.

I hate to come down on him so much, and I never have in the past. But he is just terrible in that beginning.
I sort of agree with this. Phantom is a very uneven film with many problematic aspects and just one great scene that doesn't quite shine the way it should, because the setup hasn't been laid for it properly. Clones, on the other hand, doesn't really soar at any moment and is quite possibly the biggest waste of a great score I've ever seen, but it could have been a very good film, if only Anakin had been handled with more competence, writing and acting wise.£

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I could go on the "he's not meant to be Luke who goes bad he's an emotional retard by design" rant but I won't.

Just gonna leave this here:
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Fuck the Luke who goes bad, he's not effective as the guy who's inherently dark grey to begin with, either. Vader should have been an attractive baddie, arrogant but intelligent, selfish but sympathetic, inexperienced but not foolish. What we got instead was a repulsive douche who makes you wonder why those people around him have any affection for.

Christensen and Lucas got it very right in the first two thirds of Sith, no doubt, when he's depicted as this tortured anti hero who's trying very hard to keep his demons deep inside and is very close to succeed, but then they had to ruin it in the end when he turns into this confused lunatic who utters pure nonsense in response to anything he disagrees with.£

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Crazy Eight wrote:
ArmandFancypants wrote:V
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You blow my mind.
It blows my mind how your opinion always lines up exactly with Vader. Actually it doesn't.

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i don't understand how anyone could have The Force Awakens below Attack of the Clones

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Allstar wrote:
Crazy Eight wrote:
ArmandFancypants wrote:V
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You blow my mind.
It blows my mind how your opinion always lines up exactly with Vader. Actually it doesn't.
You picked an odd opportunity to say that, since our opinion on Rogue One and the Star Wars rankings are different, but okay.

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Master Virgo wrote:Fuck the Luke who goes bad, he's not effective as the guy who's inherently dark grey to begin with, either. Vader should have been an attractive baddie, arrogant but intelligent, selfish but sympathetic, inexperienced but not foolish. What we got instead was a repulsive douche who makes you wonder why those people around him have any affection for.

Christensen and Lucas got it very right in the first two thirds of Sith, no doubt, when he's depicted as this tortured anti hero who's trying very hard to keep his demons deep inside and is very close to succeed, but then they had to ruin it in the end when he turns into this confused lunatic who utters pure nonsense in response to anything he disagrees with.£
Exactly. It's not that he should have been a Luke who goes bad.

But he could have been somebody cocky, brash but still caring for his friends, not being angsty and moody when Obi-Wan tells him off - that hsould have started after he kills his mother's killers. His ego should have been a part of his charm, much like Tony Stark. But not so repulsive. I mean, anytime he put moves on Padme I felt the creep factor going all the way up to 11. I had no idea why Obi-Wan or Padme would have felt any affinity for him.

He could have been a more likable douche. Not exactly like Han but something in that vein.

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ArmandFancypants wrote:V
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Who hurt you?

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I have no problem with Anakin feeling like a creep even before his switch to the dark side. Even in the OT Vader seems rather callous at how he sees other people's lives (killing people for petty reasons, originally only seeing his son as a pawn and having a tendency to outright mock his victims and play with his food...). Even with the dark side clouding his mind, I'd have a rather hard time seeing a paragon of virtue (no matter how conflicted) turn into someone who responds to others' gratuitous suffering with what's, at best, indifference. The Anakin of PT basically was quite the manchild - Even in his heroic moments he was petulant, enjoyed the battles and was comparatively self-centered in his interest, which is how someone could turn into Vader. The PT Anakin had a lot of problems (acting problems, clunky dialogue and stilted direction that didn't allow the first two to feel at least more natural) that made his characterization difficult to enjoy (much less understand or even believe) onscreen but I don't think the choice in characterization was itself the problem.
ArmandFancypants wrote:I could go on the "he's not meant to be Luke who goes bad he's an emotional retard by design" rant but I won't.

Just gonna leave this here:
Image
Huh. They've done a good job bridging the Clone Wars design with Forrest Whitaker.

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Cilogy wrote:
ArmandFancypants wrote:V
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Who hurt you?
Larry Kasdan

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