George wrote: Most of my points on this are centered on what it shown on the screen rather than how the story works in isolation of that. So, for instance, there's a huge difference between spending several minutes of the runtime showing the citizens of Gotham making the decision to blow up the other boat versus having that be something the main characters and audience understand is happening, but not actually being shown any of it. I'll also be operating in the realm of "is this the best we can do" when it comes to characters being active (or other things) in sequences of the film. So, for instance, Bruce Wayne is technically active when he's driving around and feeding names of police officers to Alfred, but is that really the best use of our main character?
Good films are never just merely what is on screen or what is literally happening. It's about metaphors and consequences and the broader context. The citizens of Gotham, or Harvey, or whoever don't exist in a vacuum, and to actualy humanise the consequences of the other characters actions is what sets TDK far apart (and far better) than the pack. Normally when you see innocent bystanders imperiled, it doesn't mean anything. But by dwelling on them, Nolan gives us the full weight of just what is happening, and gives us a reference point that we could all find ourselves in. It's just good storytelling.
That's coupled with the fact that Batman is at his best when he is withheld - Burton understood this too. It's the same principle of lightsabers being used sparingly in the original Star Wars films - when you have something special you keep it from the audience without battering them over the head.
George wrote:I guess this really comes down to two points. Why does Batman take responsibility for Dent's death and why does Batman take responsibility for Dent's killings. I think Vader has offered the right answer for him taking responsibility for Dent's death. Logistically it just makes sense that, particularly in order to keep the idea of Dent as Gotham's hope intact, the truth of that hostage situation and death needed to be pinned on someone other than Dent that's present at the scene.
But wholly separate (at least to me) are Dent's killings. I still think they should have been left ambiguous or blamed on the Joker, if need be. Now, ArmandFancypants points out that Batman is this highly moral figure and can't simply put the blame on someone else (Joker), no matter how despicable that someone else may be. But whether though a fault of the film's characterization, a fault of your interpretation of Batman, or just my own confusion, I'm not convinced Batman is the absolutely moral figure you paint him to be. If we want to talk Batman's lack of pure morality, look no further than the Harvey Dent cover-up or using the sonar device to find Joker. I think Batman saves Joker because he has a rule that he won't kill, not because he's a man of moral totality. Which brings me back to this: If Batman is willing to play dirty (by covering up Dent's true nature in order to secure hope for Gotham's future), why not also just blame Dent's murders on the Joker (or someone else, or leave it ambiguous)?
There's a line, and there are "rules" that are commonly refered too. Framing another man for murders he is innocent of is the line that is beyond the pale for Batman. People are not simply moral or immoral. There are shades of gray. When I say that Batman's morality isn't pure, that doesn't mean that he is a monster. He pushes the boundaries of what is ethical, but it all stems from what he originally set out to do. The sonar is an extension of his existing listening devices. The beating of an unarmed prisoner is an extension of the already present physical threat that he poses to goons.
Pinning murders on another man though has no precedent, and would make him truly despicable. The film is all about perception and what people believe to be true. "The lie is good" in
The Dark Knight's case, which is a natural follow up to
The Prestige's "The lie is necessary" and is followed by
Inception's "The lie is dangerous" (and I suspect,
The Dark Knight Rises will show us that "the lie will be found out and is bad.") As I've said, Batman starts the film concerned about his own dramatic example, and we see that people get killed trying to follow him into battle as Batman, as they are ill-equipped. "I'm not wearing hockey pads" is a gag, but it's also significant. There is absolutely no way that Bruce can convey to the people that they are not allowed to be Batman because they are not as financially endowed as he is. It would be hypocritical at best to say that he can be a law unto himself and can risk his lives to save others, but no one else is allowed to do exactly the same thing. As a result, under the banner of Batman, people are getting needlessly killed (and furthermore, people are going around dressed up like Batman wielding shotguns - look no further than Batman's introduction in the film).
That spurns on the quest to turn Harvey into the White Knight, but when that gambit has failed desperately thanks to the Joker, Batman sees the natural solution to both problems. He removes Batman as a role model and an inspiration to others, and hence no one is ever going to try and be him - he's killed cops, and he's killed a horribly damaged man who had risked his own life for the safety of Gotham by claiming to be the Batman. He creates the perfect example that people should aspire to be and removes the dangerous one entirely. It is the only true solution to the conundrum faced at the start of the film, and allows him to triumph over the Joker.
George wrote:And that's particularly important when there's a film like Heat that largely encompasses similar character dynamics and moments (and no, I'm not referring to superficial things like both films having a bank heist).
Heat is about professionalism and isolation, but
The Dark Knight is about influence and heroism and whatnot. It's the aesthetic and sometimes thematic boilerplate for the film, but saying they're the same film is like saying that
Batman Begins is just
Blade Runner with a crustier Rutger Hauer.
Ah, böwakawa! Poussé, poussé...
Ah, böwakawa! Poussé, poussé...
Ah, böwakawa! Poussé, poussé...