Joss Whedon's Comments on TDK

[Liron]

What I love so much about Batman films is that they are SO different from any other comic book film. It's not about the hero, who's a successful, rich, playboy anyway and give him more screen time when he's in his peak he'd be completely up himself Tony Stark style.. but it's not about him. It's about his choices, his morals, and yes about the bad guys cos they're the ones that in movie world, we don't really know, they're the characters the writers/directors can play with. We think we know how the hero would act when they strike, but it's their striking/actions that drive the hero and so it has to go action by villain -> choice by hero. When done right it's just better filmmaking as Nolan proved.

And RDJ... that comment.. well, really put me off him. If he's that much of an idiot that he cant get TDK or that much of a douche that he has to be an ass about its success, then seriously

[oracle86]

That dialogue convinced me in 2008 that RDJ was a douchebag, and since then, he hasn't done anything that would force me to change my opinion.

[DoubleD]

Joss Whedon's Comment on TDK was just assine.

[Egami]

Joss Whedon's Comment on TDK was just assine.

+1 both for the post and the amazing avatar.

[u2aerofan]

I guess what irks me is...the Dark Knight IS about Batman...and I'm sad that someone who is as supposedly smart as Whedon (I'm not a fan, but I see his appeal) doesn't get that. How can you not GET that? The Joker's entire scheme is to make BATMAN question everything about his identity and ethics. Batman's struggle to justify his own presence in Gotham is the heart of that movie.

Seriously...fuck that guy if he can't see it because it's just so obvious...

As for RDJ...he is not one I'd take too seriously. He's kind of a "say what I feel in the moment" guy...I guess that happens after you've hit rock bottom and don't really fear anything anymore.

[George]

Here are some of my thoughts on this. It feels a little unorganized and unfocused, but see what you think:

First off, I don't take Whedon's comment as a singular idea. He says both "Batman gets short shrift" and "It’s not about Batman." I only agree with the first statement. Batman gets the "short shrift" because the major decisions in the film are split between multiple characters, and at times completely divorced from Batman. Batman is present in so many scenes, but too many of the film's critical decisions aren't made by Batman. I'm a proponent that the "main character" status is more sided with Harvey Dent and the citizens of Gotham than it is with Batman. Their decisions ultimately have a large thematic and narrative impact on Batman, but he's too often the spectator for much of the action (though that becomes more of a problem as the film goes on). So if there's any place where The Dark Knight begins to falter, it's the second half. The film drifts away from any notion of a strong, main character to anchor the story. Though there was plenty of talk (even by Nolan) that Harvey Dent is the backbone of the film, I'm not sure that's even entirely true -- or successful. Harvey Dent has what seems like a fuller arc, but it's slightly ruined by the way he's presented in the third act. His "transformation" into Two Face feels a little false, making it difficult to really put much weight behind him. More importantly, his plot of killing those responsible for Rachel's death is almost entirely separate from the main narrative of the ferry boats and hostages...he somewhat loses status as the main character at this point when the film puts so much focus on the ferry boat conflit. And that conflict, unfortunately, has little to do with our main characters. Neither Batman nor any of the main characters have decisive power in those scenes. Focus shifts to random Gotham citizens. For the third act, they essentially become the main characters. Though their ultimate decision has a large impact on Bruce's arc in the film, Bruce has no part in their decision making.

If anyone has seen Little Miss Sunshine, there may be a great way to tie this together. Olive more immediately feels like the main character in the film. It's ostensibly about her strong desire to win this pageant. But the main character in the film is actually Richard. Richard has to make the decisions that ultimately affect whether Olive can even be present at the pageant. Decisions that will decide whether or not the family will be held together. The Dark Knight ends with Batman taking the blame for Dent's murders in what could have been a strong attempt to round out the film as being "about" Bruce. But since I still haven't heard a compelling reason why Batman had to take the blame, it just doesn't work for me.

[Allstar]

Though there was plenty of talk (even by Nolan) that Harvey Dent is the backbone of the film

Harvey Dent has what seems like a fuller arc

suck it Vader, I'll accept your apology anytime.

First off, I don't take Whedon's comment as a singular idea. He says both "Batman gets short shrift" and "It’s not about Batman." I only agree with the first statement. Batman gets the "short shrift"

Exactly and anyone who can read in between the lines knows that the first statement was all Whedon really meant so people calling him retarded is just silly.

[George]

I like how you didn't include the second half of that quote

"Though there was plenty of talk (even by Nolan) that Harvey Dent is the backbone of the film, I'm not sure that's even entirely true -- or successful."


Dent feels like more of a main character than Batman, but it would be equally misguided to say Dent is the main character. When it comes down to it, I don't think The Dark Knight really has a singular strong lead.

[Joeyjojo72]

Well said.

[Allstar]

I like how you didn't include the second half of that quote

"Though there was plenty of talk (even by Nolan) that Harvey Dent is the backbone of the film, I'm not sure that's even entirely true -- or successful."


Dent feels like more of a main character than Batman, but it would be equally misguided to say Dent is the main character. When it comes down to it, I don't think The Dark Knight really has a singular strong lead.

Yeah but the fact Nolan said it is all that matters to my claim. Vader said I did not understand the movie because I said something Nolan said.

Also George do not let Vader see what you just said because he will say you did not understand the movie. I agree with most of what you said btw.