Interstellar: The Timeless Deception

Christopher Nolan's 2014 grand scale science-fiction story about time and space, and the things that transcend them.
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celibate wrote:
Movie_Dude wrote:
celibate wrote:it's an interesting read, but it sounds like you're fighting against the ideas Nolan presented. There's no deception about the ending. What Nolan shows us, is what happened.
What do you believe were the ideas that Nolan presented?

You're possibly onto something, and the deception is on me!

Think about what the black hole represents, what's found in it, what Cooper stands for, and where you have heard it before.


There are obviously ideas floating around the throughline of it all as well, but that was at the core of it, wasnt it?
I'm sorry but I don't follow. Can you be more specific please?

As far as I'm aware, nobody knows what lies within a black hole, or what would happen were we to enter one.

Cooper stands for many things, not least the idea that the answer to man's problems can be found among the stars.

What are the ideas that you believe Nolan is presenting? Which of those ideas conflicts with my reading of the story?

Thanks

Movie Dude

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I'm not sure I have been clear enough making my point, or that I fully understand yours, so please accept my apologies if that is the case!

I don't think all of Nolan's characters delude themselves to escape their dilemma, but the dilemma itself is always resolved by means of deception. I'll examine the three examples you've stated above:

Bruce - the deception is his fake death. This enables him to start again with Selina. It's not self-deception, although this was something he was guilty of for much of the film, and has therefore grown as a character and achieved self-realisation, as you say.

Cobb - the deception is upon himself here. He refuses to watch the outcome of his spinning token. He's happy that it feels real, and his need to be with his children is so great that he either no longer cares if the reunion is authentic, or more likely, is terrified of discovering that he is in fact still in a dream.

Borden/Fallon Twins - their deception is the one they pull on their audience, Angier and us, the fourth wall. However, The Prestige is Angier's story, and he deceives himself that it doesn't matter which version of himself walks out and receives the prestige. Delusional indeed.

Self-deception isn't always the answer to the dramatic question (rarely is it not, however), but it is ever present throughout the story.
Yes. My point was not so much about the deception and the outcome. It was , as you said , deception used as a mean to resolve dilemmas. But i was trying to say something else. All the films Nolan makes (im taking Following outside of this equation because i've only seen it once and i dont remember it vividly) , characters (usually the major ones) come to a point of , lets call it , introspection. A necessity to resolve their Self and Identity. The ones who try to escape it , who don't accept their own reality or don't achieve self-realization , follow tragic paths.

Leonard is a man who lies to himself to continue a quest who has no end. After killing yet another person he decides to omit that from his "future-self" (because of the memory). This inability to cope with reality leaves him in a tragic spiral path which never ends.
Mal is a woman who doesn't accept her own reality. Doesn't accept her existence. Believes there is another level/layer of existence above the one she stands. This inability to cope with reality takes her life.
Angier is a man who sacrifices his humanity for the unknown. He literally duplicates himself , without knowing what comes after. He is always pushing for a new level of existence. This inability to cope with reality takes his life.
Dormer (this one is harder) also lives tormented by a reality that is unknown to him. Did he , or did he not take the life of his partner ? He lives with a guilt that sorta puts him on a limbo. He can't live outside that. This inability to resolve his reality (or did he in the end of the pic?) also leads to his death.

While , Cobb , Bruce Wayne and the Borden twins all accept their reality and achieve self-realization. Bruce is finally able to escape his Batman persona , Borden escapes his life-trick obsession for his child and Cobb obviously accepts the reality of a life where he can finally be together with his kids.

I was writing more about their dilemmas than their deceptions. But as you wrote , they all resort to deception. But i think the deception might lead to different paths (Leonard and Cobb , both might live tin deception , but while one purposefully rejects reality , the other accepts it)

Interstellar...i liked what you posted about it. Will think it through :thumbup:

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Movie_Dude wrote:
celibate wrote:

Think about what the black hole represents, what's found in it, what Cooper stands for, and where you have heard it before.


There are obviously ideas floating around the throughline of it all as well, but that was at the core of it, wasnt it?
I'm sorry but I don't follow. Can you be more specific please?

As far as I'm aware, nobody knows what lies within a black hole, or what would happen were we to enter one.
Science tells us the black hole destroys all light that comes within its pull. It is the scientific visual analogy for death, the end. One man goes to the end, and brings the good news back to us that at the end is light, and love. We have nothing to fear. Where have you heard of one man conquering death and spreading the Good News that we are saved to us. Gospel was the word of our ancestors.

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I see what you're getting at.

I agree with you. However, I believe Cooper brings us the news from beyond the grave. As the audience, we're omnipresent. The characters that share that fictional universe with him are not. To them, he's disappeared into the black hole, never to return.

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We are in agreement.

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celibate wrote:We are in agreement.
We are indeed.

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the only deception here was Nolan giving us the impression that this is a good movie

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Cilogy wrote:the only deception here was Nolan giving us the impression that this is a good movie
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Cilogy wrote:the only deception here was Nolan giving us the impression that this is a good movie
It appears you let others tell you what to think about a film.

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