Why am I the only one who doesn't like "Cobb doesn't care"?

This 2010 contemporary sci-fi actioner follows a subconscious security team around the globe and into the intimate and infinite world of dreams.
Rob
Posts: 419
Joined: August 2010
Location: Germany
Hey guys, I don't know if this deserves a thread, but this is really bugging me.

I was always very strictly against the fact that Cobb doesn't care if the totem falls or not in the ending scene. I always hated this idea and I still do. I thought it destroyed the whole point of the movie, but now even Chris Nolan himself confirmed that it's important that "he doesn't care". So I guess it's right, but am I the only one who doesn't like this idea?

The whole point of the movie is Cobb getting home to his kids; finding a way to cope with the death of Mal and being able to see his kids again. Okay, so he gets this offer from Saito, gets to know Ariadne who works sort of like a therapist for him (also confirmed), and he learns to cope with his demons. He learns to let go of Mal, he learns that he actually can differentiate dreams from reality ("you're just not perfect enough") and he reminds himself of the quote "it doesn't matter, because we'll be TOGETHER". Alright. So he gets home, says "fuck it, I don't care if those are my real kids, I just told Mal 'you're not perfect enough' (that's why I couldn't stay with her and the fake children right away) and now I just don't care if this is reality or not." And in the real world, his kids are never going to see their father again.

Indeed, it wouldn't matter if it's a dream or not, if it was a shared dream. Because they'd be together, you know? His kids and him living in a dream world. But it's not a shared dream, Cobb is in a dream world and his children are still in reality without their father. That's pretty sad.
Now I don't necessarily want a happy ending. It would be okay if Cobb just walked away from the top because he got distracted, but it's a dream and he doesn't know, so we can actually feel bad for him. I'd be fine with that. But Cobb saying "I don't care if it's a dream or not" kinda destroys the whole theme of "catharsis". I always thought Cobb walked away from the top because he doesn't need it anymore, because he never needed it, he just had it because he couldn't cope with the guilt and kept Mal "alive". In my interpretation he sees his children, sees how perfect they are and knows it's reality. But well, Chris just proved that wrong.

Thoughts?

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Joined: January 2011
I think one of, if not THE, major point that the film makes is that an emotional experience within a dream is as valid as one that happens in reality.

Cobb is able to finally let go of his guilt about Mal's death within a dream.
Fischer is able to see his father and himself differently, in a more positive light within a dream.
Mal starts to question her reality because of a dream.

Cobb, at the end, comes to realise that dream or not, seeing his children makes him happy.

But that's just what I think.

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Joined: August 2010
Location: Texas
Cobb never said he didn't care... He wanted to see his kids. Besides if it is a dream the thing will keep spinning and he would see it as soon as he went back to the table.

I think your just looking alittle to deep into it. The movie is whatever you what it to be. That's why Nolan left it open ended. I like the approach of leaving it that way.

As for the part about if he doesn't care that makes him a bad father..... I think it just shows not everyone is perfect. Everyone has flaws and Nolan likes to show them.

And everything Etwo said. lol

Rob
Posts: 419
Joined: August 2010
Location: Germany
Etwo wrote:I think one of, if not THE, major point that the film makes is that an emotional experience within a dream is as valid as one that happens in reality.

Cobb is able to finally let go of his guilt about Mal's death within a dream.
Fischer is able to see his father and himself differently, in a more positive light within a dream.
Mal starts to question her reality because of a dream.

Cobb, at the end, comes to realise that dream or not, seeing his children makes him happy.

But that's just what I think.
Well, definitely "an emotional experience within a dream is as valid as one that happens in reality". That's why Cobb uses the dream to overcome his guilt, thus the dream gives the basis for having a better life in reality. Cobb had issues in his life, Mal's death and the fact that he couldn't see his kids. He solved BOTH problems with the inception on Fischer - the legal issues due to Saito and the guilt-problem by accepting reality as it is. And then he gets home and he's okay if it's still a dream? Does that make sense? Why did he have to overcome the guilt in the first place then? If he thinks it's okay to be with his dream-children, why didn't he stay with dream Mal and dream children? Let go Mal and the fake children only to be okay with the fact that those children may be fake as well?

Ariadne, who helps Cobb overcome his problems, says early on in the movie "how could I ever create so much detail that it seems real?" and Cobb says "dreams seem real to us while we're in them". Then we have Ariadne helping him and in the end he realizes, she was right: He says he can't imagine Mal anymore, because he knows that dreams aren't reality.

I never had a problem with it, in fact when I heard that that was Nolan's answer I was pleasantly surprised.

It's not an apathetic "I don't care", but a I have more important things "I don't care". If that makes any sense.

Rob
Posts: 419
Joined: August 2010
Location: Germany
solo2001 wrote:I never had a problem with it, in fact when I heard that that was Nolan's answer I was pleasantly surprised.

It's not an apathetic "I don't care", but a I have more important things "I don't care". If that makes any sense.
More important things? So it's not important if Cobb's REAL kids are at home, alone, without a mother and a father, while Cobb says "ok" to the projections? He says "ok" to his children's projections but "no" to the projection of Mal? He just went through this cathartic journey of letting go the guilt, and letting the projection of his wife go, only to embrace the projections of his children. Does that make sense?

Does anyone see my point at least? :o

Posts: 15900
Joined: June 2009
Rob wrote:Hey guys, I don't know if this deserves a thread, but this is really bugging me.

I was always very strictly against the fact that Cobb doesn't care if the totem falls or not in the ending scene. I always hated this idea and I still do. I thought it destroyed the whole point of the movie, but now even Chris Nolan himself confirmed that it's important that "he doesn't care". So I guess it's right, but am I the only one who doesn't like this idea?

The whole point of the movie is Cobb getting home to his kids; finding a way to cope with the death of Mal and being able to see his kids again. Okay, so he gets this offer from Saito, gets to know Ariadne who works sort of like a therapist for him (also confirmed), and he learns to cope with his demons. He learns to let go of Mal, he learns that he actually can differentiate dreams from reality ("you're just not perfect enough") and he reminds himself of the quote "it doesn't matter, because we'll be TOGETHER". Alright. So he gets home, says "fuck it, I don't care if those are my real kids, I just told Mal 'you're not perfect enough' (that's why I couldn't stay with her and the fake children right away) and now I just don't care if this is reality or not." And in the real world, his kids are never going to see their father again.

Indeed, it wouldn't matter if it's a dream or not, if it was a shared dream. Because they'd be together, you know? His kids and him living in a dream world. But it's not a shared dream, Cobb is in a dream world and his children are still in reality without their father. That's pretty sad.
Now I don't necessarily want a happy ending. It would be okay if Cobb just walked away from the top because he got distracted, but it's a dream and he doesn't know, so we can actually feel bad for him. I'd be fine with that. But Cobb saying "I don't care if it's a dream or not" kinda destroys the whole theme of "catharsis". I always thought Cobb walked away from the top because he doesn't need it anymore, because he never needed it, he just had it because he couldn't cope with the guilt and kept Mal "alive". In my interpretation he sees his children, sees how perfect they are and knows it's reality. But well, Chris just proved that wrong.

Thoughts?

you're viewing the ending through the prism of your cold-hearted intellect...and not your warm, compassionate heart

Posts: 15900
Joined: June 2009
Rob wrote:Hey guys, I don't know if this deserves a thread, but this is really bugging me.

I was always very strictly against the fact that Cobb doesn't care if the totem falls or not in the ending scene. I always hated this idea and I still do. I thought it destroyed the whole point of the movie, but now even Chris Nolan himself confirmed that it's important that "he doesn't care". So I guess it's right, but am I the only one who doesn't like this idea?

The whole point of the movie is Cobb getting home to his kids; finding a way to cope with the death of Mal and being able to see his kids again. Okay, so he gets this offer from Saito, gets to know Ariadne who works sort of like a therapist for him (also confirmed), and he learns to cope with his demons. He learns to let go of Mal, he learns that he actually can differentiate dreams from reality ("you're just not perfect enough") and he reminds himself of the quote "it doesn't matter, because we'll be TOGETHER". Alright. So he gets home, says "fuck it, I don't care if those are my real kids, I just told Mal 'you're not perfect enough' (that's why I couldn't stay with her and the fake children right away) and now I just don't care if this is reality or not." And in the real world, his kids are never going to see their father again.

Indeed, it wouldn't matter if it's a dream or not, if it was a shared dream. Because they'd be together, you know? His kids and him living in a dream world. But it's not a shared dream, Cobb is in a dream world and his children are still in reality without their father. That's pretty sad.
Now I don't necessarily want a happy ending. It would be okay if Cobb just walked away from the top because he got distracted, but it's a dream and he doesn't know, so we can actually feel bad for him. I'd be fine with that. But Cobb saying "I don't care if it's a dream or not" kinda destroys the whole theme of "catharsis". I always thought Cobb walked away from the top because he doesn't need it anymore, because he never needed it, he just had it because he couldn't cope with the guilt and kept Mal "alive". In my interpretation he sees his children, sees how perfect they are and knows it's reality. But well, Chris just proved that wrong.

Thoughts?

you're viewing the ending through the prism of your cold-hearted intellect...and not your warm, compassionate heart


thats why youre unable to grasp the genius of it

Rob
Posts: 419
Joined: August 2010
Location: Germany
talli wrote:
Rob wrote:Hey guys, I don't know if this deserves a thread, but this is really bugging me.

I was always very strictly against the fact that Cobb doesn't care if the totem falls or not in the ending scene. I always hated this idea and I still do. I thought it destroyed the whole point of the movie, but now even Chris Nolan himself confirmed that it's important that "he doesn't care". So I guess it's right, but am I the only one who doesn't like this idea?

The whole point of the movie is Cobb getting home to his kids; finding a way to cope with the death of Mal and being able to see his kids again. Okay, so he gets this offer from Saito, gets to know Ariadne who works sort of like a therapist for him (also confirmed), and he learns to cope with his demons. He learns to let go of Mal, he learns that he actually can differentiate dreams from reality ("you're just not perfect enough") and he reminds himself of the quote "it doesn't matter, because we'll be TOGETHER". Alright. So he gets home, says "fuck it, I don't care if those are my real kids, I just told Mal 'you're not perfect enough' (that's why I couldn't stay with her and the fake children right away) and now I just don't care if this is reality or not." And in the real world, his kids are never going to see their father again.

Indeed, it wouldn't matter if it's a dream or not, if it was a shared dream. Because they'd be together, you know? His kids and him living in a dream world. But it's not a shared dream, Cobb is in a dream world and his children are still in reality without their father. That's pretty sad.
Now I don't necessarily want a happy ending. It would be okay if Cobb just walked away from the top because he got distracted, but it's a dream and he doesn't know, so we can actually feel bad for him. I'd be fine with that. But Cobb saying "I don't care if it's a dream or not" kinda destroys the whole theme of "catharsis". I always thought Cobb walked away from the top because he doesn't need it anymore, because he never needed it, he just had it because he couldn't cope with the guilt and kept Mal "alive". In my interpretation he sees his children, sees how perfect they are and knows it's reality. But well, Chris just proved that wrong.

Thoughts?

you're viewing the ending through the prism of your cold-hearted intellect...and not your warm, compassionate heart
Not at all, buddy. Seems like you didn't get me.

If Cobb doesn't care if it's reality or not, he doesn't care if they are his real children or not. That means he doesn't care if his children are in the real world without parents. Now I am the one who cares about his children. About the fact that they actually MEET, get it? Be together. As I said, if they would live in the dream world together (in a shared dream), it would be totally okay. But how can Cobb accept the fact, that those are probably not his kids? If he does accept that, he also could've accepted Mal.

Lol, yeah I get what you're saying. And It's kind of a giant middle finger to his kids. But what Cobb did with his kids you should do with you're interpretation...
Rob wrote: In my interpretation he sees his children, sees how perfect they are and knows it's reality. But well, Chris just proved that wrong.
...Whether or not it's the reality of the situation, embrace that side of it, because that's where you'll be happier. :D

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