steveportee wrote:

Bacon wrote:I don't like Obama. Or his care.
/thread

You can't vote.

Continue thread.

Treatment tips for getting majorly burned provided by Obamacare, free of charge.

Celestin wrote:

RIFA wrote:I said it in another thread... Democracy is flawed.

As a concept it isn't, but if you're talking about the way it is handled in some contries, I agree.

I believe the US system of democracy is flawed and has been for a long time.
I also believe in the two-party system, but I've since removed myself from taking either side, as I feel both parties have lost whatever principles they had before that made them both equally approachable at one point in time.

Conservatism is not all bad, and Liberalism is not all bad; some folks simply can't digest either statement.
But now, politically, we're a two-party system consisting of smoke and mirrors and little else.
I quite often feel that I don't truly know what either party thinks is truly best for the American people, and that when they state what they think is best, what they're merely stating is ideology and illogical rhetoric.
It gets so tiresome listening to an ongoing argument wherein each party simply wants to prove to the American people that they're better than the other party. Bipartisanship? Compromise? Genuine solutions from both sides for genuine problems? Forget it.

I can't fully agree or disagree with Obamacare (such a stupid word) because it's literally a catch-22.
If I choose the health care system we have in place now, ran by Big Insurance and beloved by the Republican party, I'm choosing a system so insanely corrupt, corporatized, and greedy that even with good insurance it's a huge gamble on whether or not I'll be taken care of properly or left with a large bill due to some ridiculous fine-print loophole they've managed to surprise me with at the last minute (yes, this actually happened to me), not to mention the financial and familial burden left behind should I not be covered by insurance and have to a) go into major, major debt or b) risk my health and life by opting to not get whatever it is I need medically.

On the other hand, I have to be objective and also ask how great the ACA really is. I've always been a believer in the possibility of the US changing over to a universal health care system, as I've seen first hand how such a system has positively affected Canada and various European countries. But the ACA has so much to take in, and I want to make sure as an informed citizen that it's not going to turn into a program with more flaws than actual benefits to the American citizen. That's obviously why I question the individual mandate, as I think the confusion over it being a tax versus a fine is problematic.

Honestly, I would like for it to work, but I want to feel personally invested in a program that I can believe in for the simple fact that it's what's right all our citizens, whether they lean Red or Blue, in between or on the fringe.
But studying philosophy and examining even just the American political system is eye-opening and frightening, but I wouldn't have it any other way.

Celestin wrote:

RIFA wrote:I said it in another thread... Democracy is flawed.

As a concept it isn't, but if you're talking about the way it is handled in some contries, I agree.

Hmm... I could very well disagree. Read through these when you have time. Forgotten topics where we debated this (of course, we never really got deep into it since discussion failed lol).

http://www.nolanfans.com/forums/viewtop ... =democracy
http://www.nolanfans.com/forums/viewtop ... cy#p262124

RIFA wrote:

Celestin wrote:
As a concept it isn't, but if you're talking about the way it is handled in some contries, I agree.

Hmm... I could very well disagree. Read through these when you have time. Forgotten topics where we debated this (of course, we never really got deep into it since discussion failed lol).

http://www.nolanfans.com/forums/viewtop ... =democracy
http://www.nolanfans.com/forums/viewtop ... cy#p262124

I think the best solution would be a mixture of several ideas. Democracy in its truest form is good, but no one on Earth executes is that way. Communism, IMO, is also good, but countries have never operated it properly. Of course we are not a perfect species, so we can't just blatantly say one idea is the best, it has to be a mixture of things that operates in accordance to how flawed humans are.

The GOP controlled house have voted to defund Obamacare .

manofsteel1 wrote:The GOP controlled house have voted to defund Obamacare .

Awesome, now we can finally get back to absolutely no changes in our healthcare system.

Cilogy wrote:

manofsteel1 wrote:The GOP controlled house have voted to defund Obamacare .

Awesome, now we can finally get back to absolutely no changes in our healthcare system.

You have brought up a very interesting possibility that the senate democrats will strike the bill down .

manofsteel1 wrote:

Cilogy wrote:

manofsteel1 wrote:The GOP controlled house have voted to defund Obamacare .

Awesome, now we can finally get back to absolutely no changes in our healthcare system.

You have brought up a very interesting possibility that the senate democrats will strike the bill down .

The Senate will strike it down or BO will veto the bill. They aren't going to defund it. They are just wasting time and money.

Today, the House voted for a bill that would fully repeal the Affordable Care Act .

NapoleonSolo wrote:Today, the House voted for a bill that would fully repeal the Affordable Care Act .

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